Tomas Paine - Common Sense

[Veva]

Hi,
I have to write an essay about how Thomas Paine's Common Sense infulenced the Founding fathers and thus the Declaration of Independance...
Any ideas, please? :patriot:

[BienvenuJDC]

The first thing that comes to mind is the definite influence that the Bible had on his writing. I've been told that he wasn't a Christian (although I find that hard to believe with the amounts of Biblical content he implemented). But without a doubt there is a Biblical influence in his work.

[Modest Proposal]

The first thing that comes to mind is the definite influence that the Bible had on his writing. I've been told that he wasn't a Christian (although I find that hard to believe with the amounts of Biblical content he implemented). But without a doubt there is a Biblical influence in his work.

He was definitely a theist, like many of the 'founding fathers', and like many of them, had trouble with Christian mythology. His BRILLIANT essay, "The Age of Reason," outlines his frustration with the Bible stories being taken literally, but he goes to great lengths to show that this doesn't necessitate a break with God.
Like many modern Libertarians that follow him, his ideas are based on the same foundations as people like Jefferson and Franklin. Not only do they all adhere to similar theist tendencies but they also have minimalist views of the role of government. "That government is best which governs least," as Paine says.

[dfloyd]

because, if I remember my American history correctly, Common Sense was written the winter when Washington was at Valley Forge. The declaration of Independence was already written and revised by Jefferson. I apologize if I'm wrong, but I believe Paine's Common Sense followed the Declaration of Independence. In this case, The Declaration of Independence could not have been influenced by Paine. Also, Paine was villified by many of the Revolutionists, especially after the French Revolution. But in any event, Jefferson et al were influenced by the leading philosophic writers such as Hobbes, Locke, and Reasseau. Paine was a pamphleteer and was not given much credence by Jefferson, Adams, Madison, etc.

[Uberzensch]

Thoreau said "That government is best which governs least" in Civil Disobedience.

[Modest Proposal]

Thoreau said "That government is best which governs least" in Civil Disobedience.

And I believe he quoted, perhaps unreferenced--see plagiarized--, Thomas Paine.

[Uberzensch]

And I believe he quoted, perhaps unreferenced--see plagiarized--, Thomas Paine.

Can you show me where? I know he discusses similar ideas, such as "Society is produced by our wants, and government by our wickedness; the former promotes our happiness POSITIVELY by uniting our affections, the latter NEGATIVELY by restraining our vices. The one encourages intercourse, the other creates distinctions. The first a patron, the last a punisher." or "Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one."

I may be wrong, but I can't find that quote in Paine. It is also sometimes incorrectly attributed to Thomas Jefferson. Source (http://wiki.monticello.org/mediawiki/index.php/That_government_is_best_which_governs_least)

[Modest Proposal]

Can you show me where? I know he discusses similar ideas, such as "Society is produced by our wants, and government by our wickedness; the former promotes our happiness POSITIVELY by uniting our affections, the latter NEGATIVELY by restraining our vices. The one encourages intercourse, the other creates distinctions. The first a patron, the last a punisher." or "Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one."

I may be wrong, but I can't find that quote in Paine. It is also sometimes incorrectly attributed to Thomas Jefferson. Source (http://wiki.monticello.org/mediawiki/index.php/That_government_is_best_which_governs_least)

I was being somewhat facetious when I said he plagiarized but I was pretty sure the wording came from Paine. It certainly is said by HDT, and I cannot find it in Paine so maybe we should air on the side of attributing it to the former.

[PeterL]

And I believe he quoted, perhaps unreferenced--see plagiarized--, Thomas Paine.

It was an indirect quotation, a paraphrase. The original in Paine is less epigrammatic.

[Il Penseroso]

The exact phrase appears as motto to the 1837 first issue of the United States Magazine and Democratic Review, coined by John O'Sullivan, who also originated the expression "Manifest Destiny." O'Sullivan's periodical published some early Thoreau, as well as many other early American greats.

[DanielBenoit]

The first thing that comes to mind is the definite influence that the Bible had on his writing. I've been told that he wasn't a Christian (although I find that hard to believe with the amounts of Biblical content he implemented). But without a doubt there is a Biblical influence in his work.

Sorry, Paine was a deist, as were most of the Founding Fathers.

"How different is [Christianity] to the pure and simple profession of Deism! The true Deist has but one Deity, and his religion consists in contemplating the power, wisdom, and benignity of the Deity in his works, and in endeavoring to imitate him in everything moral, scientifical, and mechanical."

"The Christian religion is a parody on the worship of the sun, in which they put a man called Christ in the place of the sun, and pay him the adoration originally payed to the sun."
-Thomas Paine

If you want an even more critical Paine, then maybe you should've read his analysis of the Bible in The Age of Reason:

"[B]ook of lies, wickedness, and blasphemy; for what can be greater blasphemy than to ascribe the wickedness of man to the orders of the Almighty!"

As a matter of fact, I find it kind of funny that you incite Paine as being so pious, he may be the worst example of Christianity amongst the Founders.

[IceM]

Did anyone else notice Tomas was meant to be spelled Thomas.*

I think Common Sense just reinforced the revolutionary fervor at the time. More than anything else, like the Declaration of Independence, it justified the reasons for separation and was meant to inspire the common-man. Then again, like dfloyd mentions, you have to check when Common Sense was published. If it was after the Declaration of Independence, the effect is almost nullified.

[Veva]

Did anyone else notice Tomas was meant to be spelled Thomas.*


Sorry, fast typing...:crazy:

[qimissung]

Veva, I wouldn't recommend using Wikipdia in your research, but it's not a bad place to get some basic information on the man, and get an idea of what he accomplished.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Paine

He is mainly noted for opening a discussion on whether or not to have a revolution against England, so he was influential in that way.

[PeterL]

He is mainly noted for opening a discussion on whether or not to have a revolution against England, so he was influential in that way.

He didn't open the discussion; he capped the discussion. Before "Common Sense" the consensus was for remaining part of England.After "Common Sense" there was majority support for independence. Polling wasn't as developed then as now, but support for independence went from less than 40% to more than 60% between the winter of 1775-6 and the sumer of 1776.

[Il Penseroso]

Polling wasn't as developed then as now . . . .

That seems an understatement. On what basis of research are those statistics grounded?

[PeterL]

That seems an understatement. On what basis of research are those statistics grounded?

Old fashioned wining it after reading a lot of commentary from that period. There were some guesses by people back then as to how many people backed which side. One can confidently say that in 1770 the overwhelming majority of people in British North America wanted to remain a part of England. By 1775 there was enough opinion for independence that Massachusetts sent an expedition against Canada, and that attack was popular until it failed.