A few questions....

[ehs13]

My first question would be, why is this world constantly at war? I know that it's mainly to get the land and material things but is there any other reason for them to be? Maybe involving the citizens? Second, Why does Julia love Winston? It says all these things that are wrong with him, then suddenly, Orwell introduces a girl who says she loves him. Third, why does Goldstein, in his book, say that it is important for artificial scarcity of goods to exist?
:confused:

[Granny5]

My first question would be, why is this world constantly at war? I know that it's mainly to get the land and material things but is there any other reason for them to be? Maybe involving the citizens? Second, Why does Julia love Winston? It says all these things that are wrong with him, then suddenly, Orwell introduces a girl who says she loves him. Third, why does Goldstein, in his book, say that it is important for artificial scarcity of goods to exist?
:confused:

I'm no expert but here's what I think:

1. Keeping the world at war keeps the masses in line. No one wants to be unpatriotic during a time of war. Just look how everyone reacted to the Iraq invasion.
2. I think Julia loved Winston as much as she was able or capable of loving anyone or anything. The same question could be asked about any relationship. Why does anyone love a loser? There has to be some redeeming feature about everyone, at least to someone.
3. The scarcity of goods also keeps the masses under control. If they think there is a real National need, then everyone will be more productive in order to help the country. No one will want to strike or demand more wages if they think they are doing their duty to their country. It's all aimed at keeping everyone under control.

[The Atheist]

Granny 5 is quite right.

Part of the appeal of Winston for Julia was that he was a rebel. She hated the party so much that anyone brave enough to be anti-Party was heroic in her eyes. Note Julia's quiet enjoyment of Wonston's reading Goldstein's book.

[jocky]

I'm no expert but here's what I think:

1. Keeping the world at war keeps the masses in line.

3. The scarcity of goods also keeps the masses under control.

Thank goodness we hardly hear the word masses used so frequently nowadays. The masses were and are a group of ill defined individuals who Orwell recognises, and identifies Julia and Winston as human beings, and that is his genius. Stalin and Hitler did not recognize individual personalities and that was the Twentieth century problem. The point I am struggling to articulate is this, Marxism, with all its ideas, could never distinguish between politics and human individualism. Once you succumb to ideas of the greater good then you are no more than an ant. Orwell realized this, as he had been a drone for the British empire, and his troubled description of the death of an elephant stamps his character as a thoroughly decent INDIVIDUAL.

[The Atheist]

... Marxism, with all its ideas, could never distinguish between politics and human individualism...

Ain't that the truth?

Dear old Marx just never understood. Those ideas and ideals look so good written down. Another Orwellism is that only the uneducated or unwise fail to see the bloody great fishhook in them.

[gofish]

In the book, Orwell writes that the slogans of the Party are War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery and Ignorance is Strength. We talked about these in concepts in my Honors English class, and we decided that the meaning of War is Peace is that if a nation is at war, it keeps the people at peace and focused on one thing only. It was a way to keep the people in line. Some people believe that a nation can be unified by hate.

Julia doesn't necessarily love Winston. They are in love with the fact that they are both interested in rebelling against Big Brother.

[The Atheist]

Some people believe that a nation can be unified by hate.

Plenty of evidence to confirm that it's true.

[Boostie16]

Julia loves Winston because it is her way of rebelling against the Party. Loving someone goes against everything Julia has been taught. So since she doesn't agree with the party it becomes her way to rebel.

[Coco]

1. War is Peace: War uses up the products of industry without ever distributing them to the people, so the high stays on top and the low stays on the bottom. Hence it maintains the status quo, so war is peace.

2. Julia starts out with Winston because she likes sex. Eventually she falls in love with him as she enjoys a private life with him. They enjoy each other's company as Party comrades cannot. They can converse about their future and prepare their own meals and have a personal connection. None of this is allowed by the Party.

3. As others have stated, the artificial scarcity keeps people "in line." Suddenly the tiniest thing will separate the "haves" from the "have nots." A razor blade is the difference between wealth and poverty. The Inner Party does not live lavishly, but they have the little things that the Outer Party does not: working elevators, good quality cigarettes, real chocolate--all things that in our current economy are available to all. Since the OP people don't have these things, the IP is way "above" them.

[6FOOTER]

First,it seems the world is at war not to kill but to destroy the enemy's economy. (If they make it, break it) No country will risk an all out war because it's too risky and dangerous and I don't believe it will ever change.

Second, I don't think Julia is really in love with Winston because it seems like their only together to rebel against the Party. It's their way of showing hatred toward the party.

Third, Golstein just wants the others to stay under control as said already.

[The Atheist]

First,it seems the world is at war not to kill but to destroy the enemy's economy. (If they make it, break it) No country will risk an all out war because it's too risky and dangerous and I don't believe it will ever change.

Not quit6e right.

The purpose of the war is to unify people, to encourage and create an outlet for hate.

It also enables the Party to create artificial shortages.


Second, I don't think Julia is really in love with Winston because it seems like their only together to rebel against the Party. It's their way of showing hatred toward the party.

I don't agree at all here, but it depends on how you view "love" and what constitutes it. Their time in the room above the shop shows that there was all the tenderness and respect needed to call it love alright.


Third, Golstein just wants the others to stay under control as said already.

This is wrong either way.

I'm pretty sure Godlstein is an invention of the Party, but if he isn't, he's certainly rebelling and encouraging rebellion.

[mollie]

I think Julia loves Winston because their outlook and understanding of the world is similar in some fundamental ways. Both are outsiders, and I think this makes them mutually sympathetic.

[The Atheist]

I think Julia loves Winston because their outlook and understanding of the world is similar in some fundamental ways. Both are outsiders, and I think this makes them mutually sympathetic.

Yep, that's it.

They're the exact equivalent of a couple marooned on a desert island - when you've got all there is, you're going to make the most of it.