prose poetry

[chrismythoi]

hello,
i was wondering if anyone could give me any info on prose poetry, and also guide me in the directikon of any famous proponents.
thanks :)

[stlukesguild]

See the French Symbolists especially: Mallarme, Baudelaire, Rimbaud, Paul Valery, etc... There are a number of examples in the French Symbolism thread.

[Pryderi Agni]

How about trying the 20th century poets? Most wrote in prose or broken verse, in nearly all the vernaculars of Europe.

[stlukesguild]

How about trying the 20th century poets? Most wrote in prose or broken verse, in nearly all the vernaculars of Europe.

Examples?

[JCamilo]

Borges, he is european after all :D

[islandclimber]

you can look at the american poets: Kerouac, Ginsberg, Burroughs, Edson, Bly, Simic Wright, Mcgrath... Edson and Simic in particular of that group wrote prose poetry..

there are a few examples of prose poetry in Neruda's "Residence on Earth"... Borges has the occasional prose poetry piece in his poetry collections.. Pessoa's prose at times is much more like poetry... In his work "The Book of Disquiet" you will find quite a few examples of prose poetry...

Canadian author Elizabeth Smart wrote a prose poetry novel called "By Grand Central Station I sat Down and Wept"

and then others such as Gertrude Stein and William Carlos Williams and Octavio paz, although I haven't read much by them... :)

[JBI]

you can look at the american poets: Kerouac, Ginsberg, Burroughs, Edson, Bly, Simic Wright, Mcgrath... Edson and Simic in particular of that group wrote prose poetry..

there are a few examples of prose poetry in Neruda's "Residence on Earth"... Borges has the occasional prose poetry piece in his poetry collections.. Pessoa's prose at times is much more like poetry... In his work "The Book of Disquiet" you will find quite a few examples of prose poetry...

Canadian author Elizabeth Smart wrote a prose poetry novel called "By Grand Central Station I sat Down and Wept"

and then others such as Gertrude Stein and William Carlos Williams and Octavio paz, although I haven't read much by them... :)

Island, you into Canadian poetry? I don't think I've seen Elizabeth Smart come up here besides what you just said.

[stlukesguild]

How about trying the 20th century poets? Most wrote in prose or broken verse

I asked for examples because I suspect that there is a confusion being made between free verse or verse that falls outside of traditional structures and meters and "prose poetry". I agree that there are plenty of examples to be found in among the 20th century... but I don't think it is anywhere near "most" poets. A great many rarely if ever used the form of prose poetry. W.S. Merwins prose works have been called "prose poetry" while he himself rejects the notion admitting that outside of the French Symbolists he found few examples of prose poetry to be of any real merit as poetry. Be that as it may I agree that we can find examples in Borges, Neruda, Paz, Simic, the Catalan, J.V. Foix, Homero Aridjis, and certainly many more...

you can look at the american poets: Kerouac, Ginsberg, Burroughs...

I'd rather not.:D

[JBI]

Also, it is noteworthy to mention that Ms. Smart, who was previously mentioned, wrote prose poetry with a strong anapestic rhythm running throughout her book By Grand Central Station I Sat Down and Wept. - also, the "free verse" of Eliot is iambic almost throughout, until Ash Wednesday, when the form changes to a mix of roughly followed closed forms, and a lot more stress-metres.

The term free verse, at any rate, has essentially been booted from discourse, and replaced with the term "open form", whereas prose poetry, in itself, is another form, though the name is misleading.

[islandclimber]

StLukes I don't particularly care for that generation of American poets either :p and I agree that there is some confusion between open form/free verse and prose poetry going on when one states most 20th Century poetry is prose poetry as in point of fact, there are very few poets who wrote any prose poetry, and even fewer exclusively in that form.. The French symbolists being prime examples and then the Latin writers not far behind, although in the cases of Paz, Borges, Neruda, etc. they did not write much in the prose poetry form, just occasional examples exist...

wasn't Eliot quite openly against Prose poetry (almost to the point of vehemence), although I think he did some experimentation with it at one point?

yeah I quite like some Canadian poetry.. I love Emile Nelligan, though this in translation, which in poetry can change alot.. Alain Grandbois, Gaston Miron also from Quebec...

and then in English, well Lampman comes to mind, Elizabeth Smart, Sonnet L'abbe, Irving Layton, some Atwood, Eli Mandel, FR Scott, Raymond Kniste, karen Solie, Milton Acorn, are some I particularly enjoy..

how about you? I think I've seen you mention you're pretty interested in Canadian poetry before?

I don't see much Canadian content discussion on this forum though, poetry or prose, although I think I saw a discussion on Avison in the poetry bookclub section here recently, but she's a poet I've never really been into...

do you read any of the poetry/lit journals here in Canada? I usually take a peak at the Malahat and Capilano Reviews and then touch on ARC... any other good ones?

[JBI]

StLukes I don't particularly care for that generation of American poets either :p and I agree that there is some confusion between open form/free verse and prose poetry going on when one states most 20th Century poetry is prose poetry as in point of fact, there are very few poets who wrote any prose poetry, and even fewer exclusively in that form.. The French symbolists being prime examples and then the Latin writers not far behind, although in the cases of Paz, Borges, Neruda, etc. they did not write much in the prose poetry form, just occasional examples exist...

wasn't Eliot quite openly against Prose poetry (almost to the point of vehemence), although I think he did some experimentation with it at one point?

yeah I quite like some Canadian poetry.. I love Emile Nelligan, though this in translation, which in poetry can change alot.. Alain Grandbois, Gaston Miron also from Quebec...

and then in English, well Lampman comes to mind, Elizabeth Smart, Sonnet L'abbe, Irving Layton, some Atwood, Eli Mandel, FR Scott, Raymond Kniste, karen Solie, Milton Acorn, are some I particularly enjoy..

how about you? I think I've seen you mention you're pretty interested in Canadian poetry before?

I don't see much Canadian content discussion on this forum though, poetry or prose, although I think I saw a discussion on Avison in the poetry bookclub section here recently, but she's a poet I've never really been into...

do you read any of the poetry/lit journals here in Canada? I usually take a peak at the Malahat and Capilano Reviews and then touch on ARC... any other good ones?

I don't have the cash for them, so I just go to Robarts here in Toronto and browse Malahat Review, The Fiddlehead, and Canadian Literature Quarterly, which aren't exclusive to poetry, though I generally devour the whole catalog that is published by Brick Books and House of Anansi.

I know most Canadian poets, especially the English ones, and have a particular liking to P K Page, Erin Mouré, Earle Birney, Anne Carson, Gwendolyn MacEwan, Phylis Webb, amongst many others. Right now I am really into the new poet Susan Goyette, for instance, and Robert Kroetsch, though he is such an eccentric. Oh, and George Elliot Clarke - love his work too.

[islandclimber]

yeah I don't have cash for lit journals either, I usually drop in at the UBC library and try to find them, etc... I don't actually have subscriptions to any, besides Malahat Review as that was a gift from someone.. is the catalog from Brick Books and House of Anansi good?

Erin Moure is good, and George Eliot Clarke is just great.. I love the poems Ballad of a Hanged Man and Watercolour for Negro Expatriates in France... I don't know a few of others you mentioned, or have read very little of them.. I'll have to check out Robert Kroetsch though... eccentrics always make for interesting reading...

[islandclimber]

From Watercolour for Negro Expatriates in France

What are calendars to you?
And, indeed, what are atlases?
Time is cool jazz in Bretagne,
you, hidden in berets or eccentric scarves,
somewhere over the rainbow –
where you are tin-men requiring hearts,
lion-men demanding courage,
scarecrow-men needing minds all your own
after DuBois made blackness respectable.

[mortalterror]

you can look at the american poets: Kerouac, Ginsberg, Burroughs...

I'd rather not.:D
That generation of American poets, and Whitman himself for that matter always reminds me of this. Example 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32NaIlp4djw), Example 2
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKGc-lBYedA)

[JBI]

yeah I don't have cash for lit journals either, I usually drop in at the UBC library and try to find them, etc... I don't actually have subscriptions to any, besides Malahat Review as that was a gift from someone.. is the catalog from Brick Books and House of Anansi good?

Erin Moure is good, and George Eliot Clarke is just great.. I love the poems Ballad of a Hanged Man and Watercolour for Negro Expatriates in France... I don't know a few of others you mentioned, or have read very little of them.. I'll have to check out Robert Kroetsch though... eccentrics always make for interesting reading...

Kroetsch is a bit of a legendary figure in Canadian post-modernism - Linda Hutcheon went so far as to name him "Mr. Postmodern in Canada" - his works are quirky as they deny all form and classification, though, they are tricky as hell to read as they often have writing in three margins, and in nonsensical forms - though, perhaps reading his novel first will help.

As for Brick Books - they occasionally put out some very interesting volumes - for a nice catalog of their work get out a copy of New Life in Dark Seas: Brick Books 25 - which is essentially a catalog of all the poets they published up until, I think 2001, so a bit dated now perhaps.

Anansi is perhaps a bit better, in some ways, as it has many established names, but in others perhaps worse, as it has a great deal of toss - also, the quality of publishing in Brick Books is top notch - the paper fantastic, etc. (though the price steep), whereas Anansi's is just OK really, and there are a lot of mediocre poets.

Also, Brick Books likes to publish anthologies that function as anthologies which is a strange sort of form, and not the most common type of publishing for poetry, so that perhaps may not be to your taste.