Dissertation Consideration

[LitNetIsGreat]

I am about to plan my dissertation for my degree (10,000-12,000 words I think) and I am seriously considering Paradise Lost as the subject for it. The good thing is that as my degree is part-time I have two years to work on it, so I’m not in a particular rush at the moment, although I am reading around the subject quite a lot. However I have a couple of concerns about my choice which I am looking for some input on. I have not met with my tutor yet as it is too early, but I would be grateful for any thoughts in the meantime.

One of the main issues is that I am worried that Paradise Lost may be too long a work to be able to successfully write a dissertation on. At least this is the initial feedback I have had from a couple of people. So that is concern number one.

Concern number two is that, although I have not refined my question, I am particularly interested in the role of Satan in the poem, particularly in terms of his being, if not “good” then certainly not wholly “bad”. The concern is however that this is far from an original angle to take. I am perfectly aware that this is in fact quite a common position in which to read the poem. However I am just very interested in pursuing this argument, for the hell of it, (if you excuse the pun) and if the angle would not be original, then at least my own argument would be. However is this enough?

Those are the two concerns I have.

Strange really, I always thought that my dissertation would be on Wilde, or at least some aspect of later Victorian fiction as this is where a great bulk of my reading lies. I could write something on Wilde in my sleep, however I thought why not go into a different era and expand my knowledge there? After all I have enough time to become more familiar with 17th century society and I really want to devote my time to Milton’s great epic. I just want to read this work over and over again, so I might as well do a dissertation on it if I can.

Anyway, do you think that my dissertation could work? Albeit that I have been a bit vague, but that is where I am at present. Failing that, I could turn to a “lesser” Milton work, but I don’t really want to, naturally I would read his complete works, but I want to focus on Paradise Lost really if I could.

Any thoughts, thanks.

[Virgil]

Neely I don't think the length of a work matters on the length of the thesis. The length of the thesis really depends on you central theisis, how much expansion and elaboration it requires.

As to your idea for the role of satan, you might want to look at how satan has been seen by critical theorists and the general public through the ages, from Milton's day down through the 18th century, through the romantics to moderns and contemporary. The thesis would be the evolution of how we read the satan character. Just a thought.

By the way, if I were you I would send Petrach's Love here on lit net a note for suggestions. She's an expert in Milton's era of literature.

[LitNetIsGreat]

Thanks for your reply, your comments please me greatly, honestly. You have given me something to think on too. Thanks again.

[Mr Endon]

One of the main issues is that I am worried that Paradise Lost may be too long a work to be able to successfully write a dissertation on. At least this is the initial feedback I have had from a couple of people. So that is concern number one.

Really? I don't think so at all. For example, my dissertation will comprise of at least 5 novels (+12,000 pages) of primary text, nevermind the author's other novels and poems and plays which I might mention in passing, and my limit is 15,000. A friend of mine is actually doing a dissertation in which he'll be analysing the whole of Thomas Pynchon's oeuvre.

Like Virgil said, length of primary text doesn't really matter, as it depends on your topic: it might be a minor theme across 2000 years of literature or an incredibly close analysis of part of a novel.


Concern number two is that, although I have not refined my question, I am particularly interested in the role of Satan in the poem, particularly in terms of his being, if not “good” then certainly not wholly “bad”. The concern is however that this is far from an original angle to take. I am perfectly aware that this is in fact quite a common position in which to read the poem. However I am just very interested in pursuing this argument, for the hell of it, (if you excuse the pun) and if the angle would not be original, then at least my own argument would be. However is this enough?

Like you said this is not exactly a bold thesis statement as it is now, but you have a long time to decide what your focus will be. The advice I was given was to read the primary texts and then read a good deal of literary criticism; hopefully you'll start thinking "no one seems to mention this, no one seems to have looked into that", and voilá, you might have found your El Dorado!

It doesn't have to be wholly original either, but it must add something to what already exists. Virgil's idea seems to be quite a good one.


Strange really, I always thought that my dissertation would be on Wilde, or at least some aspect of later Victorian fiction as this is where a great bulk of my reading lies. I could write something on Wilde in my sleep, however I thought why not go into a different era and expand my knowledge there? After all I have enough time to become more familiar with 17th century society and I really want to devote my time to Milton’s great epic. I just want to read this work over and over again, so I might as well do a dissertation on it if I can.

I was trying to suggest a topic which somehow would allow you to deal with both Milton and Wilde, but that's too much of a stretch of imagination for me. Should you find any point of contact between the two give it a thought. This is all very far-fetched, of course, but it's one way of coming up with dissertation topics. I've known one or two successful instances.

Hope I was of help!

[Virgil]

Thanks for your reply, your comments please me greatly, honestly. You have given me something to think on too. Thanks again.

You're welcome Neely. Glad I could be of help. Like I said, check with Petrarch too.

[LitNetIsGreat]

Thanks Mr Endon, the only connection with Wilde and Milton that I can think of at hand is Wilde's sonnet "To Milton" - To Milton I think thy spirit has passed away/From these white cliffs and high enbattled towers etc, Wilde in true fashion "borrowed" the white cliffs and enbattled tower part from a unknown female poet, I recall reading his appreciation of the line in his letters and then thinking hold on you've "borrowed" that. Incidentally this is one of the first ever poems I committed to memory, but that is beside the point and not of any importance. Although I think if I did focus on Wilde I could do a strong paper. However, no I want to do Milton, though I do love Wilde dearly.

I am glad that you think the length is not an issue, I must admit I personally didn't think it mattered until a couple of people gave me doubts about it.

With point number two I think you are right again, the more I dig the more I will uncover something worth pursuing along the same lines of enquiry.

Thanks for your input, I have a lot of thinking to do...

[Dark Lady]

I have a feeling I'm just going to be reiterating here but thought that might not be bad. At the very least it lets you see how many people think this will work for you.

As has been said, I don't think the length of PL will be a problem at all. I wrote an essay in my exams on PL, which, considering the time restriction, was probably only about a thousand or so words. It really depends on what aspect of the poem you choose to write on. The whole point of a dissertation is that it gives you the choice to either be incredibly specific and go into one thing in immense detail or to cover a wide range in much less detail.

As for the angle you have chosen I would agree with Virgil in that you should take a step back and try to find a different way of looking at the question of Satan and his role. Obviously some of the ways that have been done a lot are: comparing the character of God with the character of Satan; looking at the physical transformation that occurs with Satan as his ideals and reasons shift throughout the poem; thinking about whether he can fit into the role of tragic hero. If you can find something a bit different (like Virgil's idea of tracking the views on Satan since PL was written) then I think you could write a great dissertation despite the area being such a popular one.

I hope that is of some help. I never had to write a dissertation in this way as I managed to get into a creative writing course within my degree that allowed me to submit a piece of creative writing as my English Literature dissertation.

[PoeticPassions]

I love Paradise Lost. If I was getting my PhD in English, I would consider doing my dissertation on PL.

In particular, I find Milton's own participation in the text quite intriguing... What role does he play in his portrayal of Satan? Is he truly of the Devil's party as Blake classifies him? (due to the fact that he is a poet he already becomes part of this "Devil's party")

If you want to look at the "good" and "bad" aspects of Satan you should most definitely evaluate the role of imagination. The corruptive, yet the freeing aspects of it. Satan is the most imaginative character in the work, in my opinion, and has the most beautiful rhetoric and persuasive powers. Whereas, when God speaks he often seems dull and unimaginative.

Then again this is probably something that has been analyzed over and over again.... so not too original.

Just want to say that I support your choice of PL for your dissertation. Good luck!

[LitNetIsGreat]

Again thanks a lot, it does help to set my mind at rest. I like the ideas brought out so far and I think that I will be able to find a new angle in the familiar area of Satan's character etc the more I read. Having had at bit of negative feedback on my ideas previously I am now feeling a lot better (also spoke to a lit student at work today about it) and really looking forward to it. After all, it is a great opportunity to explore something I am very interested in. Cheers.

[JBI]

It's interesting, though, I think the motives of Satan have undergone changes in interpretation over time - whether not wholly bad is debatable, in the sense that the Shelleyan concept of Satan is quite probably different than the one Milton envisioned. I'm no expert on this time period, though Petrarch's Love is, but I'm sure there has already been much ink spilled on the subject, so a browsing of basic bibliography would probably be in order in coming up with a more - unique - sounding thesis.

I think though, that if you are just doing something for the sake of it, it probably isn't a good idea - by the time you are done reading the text for the dissertation, chances are, you will never want to read it again - pick something that you think you can read and still maintain interest in over an extensive period of time, and something that really connects with what you want to say - after all, there will be an argument, so you generally will be considering a perspective, and a theoretical perspective, so if you aren't interested in, to the point where you can spend years reading books about the book, then chances are, another text will probably work well.

That's all I can really say, having never written one myself (and probably won't ever write one of this type). But I think, if you really care about the subject, you can work something out that fits the length - probably a narrower frame, or a selective approach.

[LitNetIsGreat]

Yes I've certainly got to come up with a more detailed thesis, but I have a full year just to put in my thesis statement (May 2010), and a further year to write it. So I am not worried at all about this, in fact I would rather get a general feel for things at present.

I just wanted to be clear that the length of Paradise Lost and the general thesis area isn't totally unacceptable, which I now feel reassured about thanks to the good people here and a few others elsewhere. :thumbs_up

I want to spend most of the summer re-reading PL a few more times and the rest of Milton, as well as reading some historical background and criticism. I can then start to define the particular angle I wish to take and narrow down my thesis accordingly. However the time I have means that I can easily break away and read other stuff that may take my fancy, but it would be folly not to take advantage of the glorious spare time I have at present and the time I am about to get very soon.

Thanks all.

[The Comedian]

Neely,

I agree with the general thrust of the thread's advice here -- I will add that doing a dissertation on something you're curious about as opposed to something you know a lot about already (something you could do "in your sleep") I think will give your focus and emotional effort a little more umph, if you take my meaning.

The joy in research is learning and writing a dissertation (at least what I know of it in the American system) is a marathon of mental energy and emotional commitment.

Good Hunting!

[Virgil]

Neely it took me a year probably to settle in on a thesis, and that after I had started one on a different thesis. So don't panic. Give it careful considereation. You'll be living with this subjsect for a while, so you better like it. For me after reading and writing on DH Lawrence for over a year and nothing else, I began to get sick of him. :D It took me a good five years after completeing the thesis to get back to enjoying Lawrence again. :)

[Kafka's Crow]

So the TIME has come Neely, eh? Thesis for a 1st degree needs not be very original. They will be more interested in your research methodology and presentation/ documentation skills. You can start with an introductory chapter on The Milton Controversy, and then two on for and against arguments using Milton's style as your guide and find clues in there to support or refute arguments, thus making your playing-field bigger. A conclusion with your own point of view with supportive evidence from the text can get the trick done. There is still life left in this old horse and there is nothing that enthusiasm and genuine interest can not accomplish.

[LitNetIsGreat]

Ah, thanks. Yes I did originally think that they don't have to be that original, though some people worried me about that (not here). I definitely think splitting the work into three chapters/areas is going to be the best way to approach the thing. I've certainly got bags of enthusiasm and interest to spare. Thanks for your thoughts.

[mono]

Very brave of you to tackle such a challenging work of literary art, Neely - impressive! Do you think you would encorporate any of Paradise Regained in the thesis, too? Just curious. And do you write this for an M.A. or Ph.D.?

One of the main issues is that I am worried that Paradise Lost may be too long a work to be able to successfully write a dissertation on. At least this is the initial feedback I have had from a couple of people. So that is concern number one.

Concern number two is that, although I have not refined my question, I am particularly interested in the role of Satan in the poem, particularly in terms of his being, if not “good” then certainly not wholly “bad”. The concern is however that this is far from an original angle to take. I am perfectly aware that this is in fact quite a common position in which to read the poem. However I am just very interested in pursuing this argument, for the hell of it, (if you excuse the pun) and if the angle would not be original, then at least my own argument would be. However is this enough?
As Mr Endon related, the comparison of Paradise Lost's length as opposed to combined novels does not appear too thick a clump of pages, but, I agree, one must take into account the complexity of Milton. With the astounding numbers of metaphors (whether Biblical, historical, political, in Milton's time or not), getting past some of the older English, and dissecting it all, I would think that you have quite the literary journey ahead of you. I think it wise to deduct certain elements of the poem, as you mentioned, like Satan, and focus primarily on that character, because writing a thesis in 2 years on every character of the poem sounds a bit challenging, if you value sleep, work, and a social life away from your thesis.
The topic, nonetheless, sounds logical, interesting, original, and worth pursuing (personally, I would read it ;), though I have never delved too deep into Milton). As to whether it sounds like "enough" or not, one could expand this topic of whether Satan appears wholly "bad," the opposite of "good," even as the sole representative of evil, very far, both in a quantitative and qualitative analysis in the thesis, on literary, philosophical, and religious-spiritual perspectives.
Good luck, and keep us up-to-date how things go! :)

[LitNetIsGreat]

Thanks very much Mono.

It is just for a humble BA, though one which will have taken me seven years to achieve and I am sure that I have packed a lot more into than I would have been able to studying full-time.

I intend to stick more or less entirely with Paradise Lost I think, focusing on the relative good/evil of Satan and God, even the cruelty of God. Though as I have said that is likely to vary the more I delve into it and to refine my actual ideas better.

Yes, I'll keep you updated though, thanks for the interest.

[Virgil]

That's a pretty substantial work for a B.A. Do you have an advisor? You should pass your thoughts through a thesis advisor.

[LitNetIsGreat]

That's a pretty substantial work for a B.A. Do you have an advisor? You should pass your thoughts through a thesis advisor.

Yes, but I don't meet with her until September. Maybe I will pass on a few thoughts, why do you think that this is too big an undertaking for a BA? I will probably have around 12,000 words to work with.

[Virgil]

That's about the size of my master's thesis. And I don't believe my college required a thesis on a bachelor level. (I didn't have a B.A. in literature; I had a B.S. in mechanical engineering, and so I'm not totally familiar with the lit students requirements.)

Before you get too far I would pass your ideas by her. My first attempt at a master's thesis had to be abandoned once I met with an advisor. And I had started the research and writing. I had to scrap it and go with another topic.