Science fiction as satire

[staka]

I need help with analysing how the topic 'science fiction as satire - technology and satire' relate to 1984, or possibly Animal Farm as well.

[Wilde woman]

Hmmm, the basic idea you're going for here is that even though everyone thinks advances in science and technology will solve all the world's problems, books like 1984 say otherwise. They argue that the more technology advances, the more those in power will use it to oppress the common people and deprive them of their humanity. That's not necessarily satire, but there's definitely irony in there.

Here's a bit more on the theme of "technology and modernization" in 1984: http://www.shmoop.com/theme/literature/george-orwell/1984/technology-and-modernization.html

Also check out the "quotes" section.

Good luck!

[The Atheist]

I need help with analysing how the topic 'science fiction as satire - technology and satire' relate to 1984, or possibly Animal Farm as well.

The only way I can see around this topic is that some of Orwell's technology as borrowed from science fiction - telescreens, etc - were generally used as means of good, while Orwell shows their ability to be abused by political desires.

I think it's stretching the definition of satire a bit, and tell your teacher I said so!

:D

(Ask her to come and argue it with me as well - we need more teachers in here!)

[Gladys]

I think it's stretching the definition of satire a bit, and tell your teacher I said so!

I'm unsure of your meaning.

I presume 1984 satirises the totalitarian tendency of Western governments - for instance, Joseph McCarthy's USA of the late 1940's. The novel is science fiction in that exhaustive video and audio surveillance was implausible in 1949, and 'Mutual Assured Destruction' was some years into the future.

[Don Quixote Jr]

I need help with analysing how the topic 'science fiction as satire - technology and satire' relate to 1984, or possibly Animal Farm as well.

I don't believe either 1984 or Animal Farm qualify as SF. Animal Farm is a fable, and I'm relying on the dictionary definition of fable. 1984 doesn't really involve much science, nor is it futuristic: The original title was 1948, (the year of publication) which Orwell's publisher refused to use; so he simply inverted the last 2 digits. Both books could be viewed as satirical, but I fail to see much SF in 1984 & any at all in Animal Farm.

[The Atheist]

The original title was 1948, (the year of publication) which Orwell's publisher refused to use; so he simply inverted the last 2 digits.[/I]

Urban myth.

Edit:

Sorry about the two-word answer, but this subject bugs me, because it's wrong, and it's persistent.

The transposition of years is a red herring. If there was any meaning in it all, it was might have been a mild jape, but no more. Orwell was not parodying life in 1948 in England. The reason it bugs me is because it's just another misuse of Orwell, which, with the growth of various conspiracy theories, has become legion. Such, such are the joys of Orwell, that we always know what he means.

He wrote the books with a deliberate intent - and then went on to explain why, both verbally and in writing, exactly what he meant.

The publisher theory is refutable on two counts:

One - there is no evidence for it.

Two - Orwell wouldn't have stood for it.

Three - nobody who knew Orwell has ever suggested there is any truth in it.

[The Atheist]

I'm unsure of your meaning.

I don't think there is any intentional or unintentional satirising of science fiction in either book.


I presume 1984 satirises the totalitarian tendency of Western governments - for instance, Joseph McCarthy's USA of the late 1940's.

Only in some degree. Orwell didn't really believe that western governments were heading for totalitarianism, and the book wasn't intended to satirise Russia - he'd already done that. The book was always intended to be a stark warning against any kind of totalitarianism, especially because Orwell believed he'd discovered a way that it could work permanently.

[staka]

I guess there is no technology seen in Animal Farm.


The novel is science fiction in that exhaustive video and audio surveillance was implausible in 1949, and 'Mutual Assured Destruction' was some years into the future.

The satire in the novel, as a science fiction, is that the author predicted the surveillance using technology will comeabout? Or did Orwell just replace something with technology to show the excessive amount of surveillance they were having at the time?

[The Atheist]

I guess there is no technology seen in Animal Farm.

Well, I guess you could put the windmill into the realm of science fiction, because it was scientific and fictional - both in the book and in the minds of the pigs.

The funny thing is, it satirises the USSR's engineering efforts in the 1960s - 1990, but since Orwell wasn't there to see it, it's a bit of a stretch.


The satire in the novel, as a science fiction, is that the author predicted the surveillance using technology will comeabout? Or did Orwell just replace something with technology to show the excessive amount of surveillance they were having at the time?

To me, the problem is that seeing it as satirical puts the cart before the horse. It presupposes that Orwell meant the technology to be satirical, while I'm sure the technology only exists to effect the surveillance requirements of the Party, and therefore any satire is unintentional, and a bit of a red herring.

[Gladys]

I need help with analysing how the topic 'science fiction as satire - technology and satire' relate to 1984...

I understand the topic to means: Orwell's use of science fiction and technology in satirising the totalitarian tendencies of post World War II governments.

[The Atheist]

I understand the topic to means: Orwell's use of science fiction and technology in satirising the totalitarian tendencies of post World War II governments.

That would be a dishonest approach as it was written immediately post-WWII and wasn't intended to satirise any of the governments at that stage.

As I said above, you can do a kind of post hoc satirical look at some post-WWII regimes, but it's not why the book was written.

[Gladys]

That would be a dishonest approach as it was written immediately post-WWII...

I see. Since Oceania represents the West, I had presumed that the seeds of, for instance, Joseph McCarthy's anti-communism in USA were apparent soon after WWII, a few years before the publication of 1984 in 1949. Did Orwell take some years to write the novel?

In view of the growing invasion of privacy early in the 20th century, is Orwell satirising:

communism


socialist tendencies worldwide


totalitarian tendencies in any government


or all of the above?


Has Orwell, himself, told us?

[The Atheist]

I see. Since Oceania represents the West, I had presumed that the seeds of, for instance, Joseph McCarthy's anti-communism in USA were apparent soon after WWII, a few years before the publication of 1984 in 1949. Did Orwell take some years to write the novel?

No, he didn't take that long to write it, but he'd lived a solitary lifestyle, far removed from contact with USA and it just wouldn't have been on the radar. Plus, even though McCarthyism was awful, it was anti-communist and anti-totalitarian by default, so wouldn't have fitted in the story.


In view of the growing invasion of privacy early in the 20th century, is Orwell satirising:

communism


socialist tendencies worldwide


totalitarian tendencies in any government


or all of the above?


Has Orwell, himself, told us?

Yes, Orwell was very clear that the book, and most of his late writing, was anti-totalitarian.

Orwell himself had communistic leanings which he'd overcome, but remained a democratic socialist. It wasn't the theory of communism, but the practice, which can only be instituted through totalitarian regimes, which Orwell hated.

[Gladys]

Orwell himself had communistic leanings which he'd overcome, but remained a democratic socialist. Having strayed from the thread topic, I'll canvass Orwell's intentions further in Big Brother And The Party (www.online-literature.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44140).