Henry Thoreau

[Nerd]

Thoreau is such an amazing philosopher, I decided that some time --and space-- needs to be dedicated to his thoughts.

One of the reasons H. Thoreau wrote his Walden is that he wanted to lessen that "gulf of ignorance." His advice on education is strikingly pragmatic. But the entire book can be viewed as a great metaphor carrying its latent educational message like that contained in the "The Pond in Winter" chapter:


If we knew all the laws of Nature, we should need only one fact, or the description of one actual phenomenon, to infer all the particular results at that point. Now we know only a few laws, and our result is vitiated, not, of course, by any confusion or irregularity in Nature, but by our ignorance of essential elements in the calculation. Our notions of law and harmony are commonly confined to those instances which we detect; but the harmony which results from a far greater number of seemingly conflicting, but really concurring, laws, which we have not detected, is still more wonderful. The particular laws are as our points of view, as, to the traveler, a mountain outline varies with every step, and it has an infinite number of profiles, though absolutely one form".


Here Thoreau expresses his quite modern opinion that the goal of an education should be the development of critical thinking, which would allow man to perceive the interrelatedness of phenomena. Today that goal remains the same.


He persued a teaching career, but left the school because he refused to administer corporal punishment. He never quit teaching, though. (Don't you wish you'd met him?)

To further quote Walden (my favorite excerpt!),


I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately, to front only the essential facts of life, and see if I could not learn what it had to teach, and not, when I came to die, discover that I had not lived. I did not wish to live what was not life, living is so dear; nor did I wish to practice resignation, unless it was quite necessary. I wanted to live deep and suck out all the marrow of life, to live so sturdily and Spartan- like as to put to rout all that was not life, to cut a broad swath and shave close, to drive life into a corner, and reduce it to its lowest terms, and, if it proved to be mean, why then to get the whole and genuine meanness of it, and publish its meanness to the world; or if it were sublime, to know it by experience, and be able to give a true account of it in my next excursion.


It is clear that he, himself, believed that life was a pond to be jumped in. Oh, I really admire his philosophy. I hope this will inspire some thought.

[chispa]

Hello Nerd...I am an admirer of Thoreau too

I like this quote of him:
"If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away. "

[trismegistus]

Thoreau was a genius and "On the Duty of Civil Disobedience" speaks as powerfully now as it did in his own day, maybe more so. In a political climate where it is widely considered unpatriotic to second guess this administration's overseas aggression, Thoreau's thoughts on man's duty to himself and to his fellow man are utterly invaluable.

[mono]

I, too, cannot possibly express my strong affinity for Henry David Thoreau. I read a relatively thick book containing four of his works, Walden, Civil Disobedience, Concord, and A Week on the Concord and Merrimack Rivers, all of which I could read over and over again out of inspiration. One can easily perceive how he took part in the group of 'transcendentalists,' including Ralph Waldo Emerson, William Ellery Channing, and Margaret Fuller.
How inspiring that he carried his views sometimes at such extreme measures, such as, you said, Nerd, of his opposition to pursuing a career in teaching, his refusal of conformation to sociological pressures (such as, then, living the pre-American dream, so to speak), and actually getting arrested once for refusing to pay taxes (as he never condoned rewarding a country that supported slavery). Much of Thoreau's amazing philosophical thought would later highly influence another great mind, Mahatma Mohandes K. Gandhi, who carried Thoreau's idea of "civil disobedience" to another extreme.

[country doctor]

I, too, cannot possibly express my strong affinity for Henry David Thoreau. I read a relatively thick book containing four of his works, Walden, Civil Disobedience, Concord, and A Week on the Concord and Merrimack Rivers, all of which I could read over and over again out of inspiration. One can easily perceive how he took part in the group of 'transcendentalists,' including Ralph Waldo Emerson, William Ellery Channing, and Margaret Fuller.
How inspiring that he carried his views sometimes at such extreme measures, such as, you said, Nerd, of his opposition to pursuing a career in teaching, his refusal of conformation to sociological pressures (such as, then, living the pre-American dream, so to speak), and actually getting arrested once for refusing to pay taxes (as he never condoned rewarding a country that supported slavery). Much of Thoreau's amazing philosophical thought would later highly influence another great mind, Mahatma Mohandes K. Gandhi, who carried Thoreau's idea of "civil disobedience" to another extreme.

the doc is reading this book right now...finished 'a week...' and 'civil disobedience' already and am 40 pages plus into 'walden'...a guy who figured it out, folks...if you haven't read this book already, what are you waiting for?

[blackbird_9]

Q: What's one way to learn about the transcendentalists?
A: Do a Thoreau analysis!
Ba-dum-ching!
I made that one up myself.
An now back to your regularly scheduled discussion.

[Syd A]

(Don't you wish you'd met him?)

There's nothing I wouldn't give to have dinner with that man. His greatest work was not Walden; he shone most brightly in Civil Disobedience, Slavery in Massachusetts, and Life Without Principle.

[laymonite]

Q: What's one way to learn about the transcendentalists?
A: Do a Thoreau analysis!
Ba-dum-ching!
I made that one up myself.
An now back to your regularly scheduled discussion.

I'll admit: I like this joke and will reuse it, possibly claiming self-origination!

Each year since 2003, my wife and I spend the first weekend in October at her uncle's cabin (his name is not Tom), which is set in the woods off the Blue Ridge Parkway in Virginia. The cabin is surrounded by dense acreage (or, the Virginia equivalent; Mainers hold your laughter at the qualification of "dense") of silent woods and creeks and streams, etc. It is a tradition of mine to take one book along for the annual cabin-weekend getaway: Thoreau's Walden. Every time I read it, it seems to become more intense, passionate, and, well, relevant. It's that rare gem where the prose (call it aesthetic if need-be) and content are both operating on a high plane. Walking through the woods reading Thoreau--ever mindful of stumps of course--I am always elevated in my thinking and my perspective.

Another tidbit: A friend of mine, who is a long time reader of nonfiction (mostly history, theology, and technoculture) told me that he decided to start branching out into literature, as in, I assume, the academia humanities brand of Literature that we all, here, celebrate. And, I suppose, since he grew up in the South, Faulkner was what he chose. That is to say, what was readily available in his mind as a literary author. So, this guy chooses As I Lay Dying as his first venture into literary fiction. He was disgusted, frustrated, etc. ad infinitum. I tried to explain some things to him; to setup his up with some "key terms/devices" if you will, e.g. stream of consciousness, perspective shifts, imagism/symbolism, etc. No dice. He felt as if his intelligence had been insulted by Mr. Faulkner. We hashed over it and other options for days, but nothing would take. Finally, it clicked. Henry Thoreau. Suffice it to say, this friend is reading it for the second time and is anxious for more "real literature" (his words) like it.

And now for the words that get me every October:

"The rays which stream through the shutter will no longer be remembered when the shutter is wholly removed."

One personal interpretation: We only understand Nature through the filter of man-made technology.

[country doctor]

the doc has spent his past four summers w/o a car and five and a half miles from 'town', out in the pines near a lake...he hikes and bikes into town when he needs to get his supplies...takes his baths in the lake and 'roughs it' ala thoreau...close enough to civilization, but still out in the peace and quiet of the woods...

some of the best living you can do, in the doc's opinion...

[The Comedian]

I've read nearly all of Thoreau's works: Walden, Cape Cod, The Maine Woods, A Week. . ., all of his essays, and selections from his journals. I read Walden every spring, each re-read is a spiritual re-alignment for me. It's also some of the finest nature writing ever written -- as is most of Thoreau's work.

If you want to read more Thoreau, I heartily recommend The Maine Woods as a rival to Walden -- Walden is better, no doubt, but The Maine Woods is a wonderful work in which we see Thoreau revisit a place three separate times over a span of about 20 years (don't quote me on the time span). I posted a review of The Maine Woods on this forum a while ago.

Also, you might enjoy the first several chapters of Cape Cod -- my least favorite overall work, but the first few chapters are great: Thoreau walks along the Cape just as a ship (the St. John, I believe) is wrecked and the flotsam and jetsam start to wash ashore. He also observes the various people there to "clean up" (aka steal) the valuable materials left by the wreck.

[laymonite]

the doc has spent his past four summers w/o a car and five and a half miles from 'town', out in the pines near a lake...he hikes and bikes into town when he needs to get his supplies...takes his baths in the lake and 'roughs it' ala thoreau...close enough to civilization, but still out in the peace and quiet of the woods...

some of the best living you can do, in the doc's opinion...

Hello, my name is Chris, and I am jealous of you!

[country doctor]

well the doc feels that he's been pretty much living along thoreau's precepts for awhile now...but it was just a couple of weeks ago, that he had the privilege of actually reading the thoughts of the man himself...while perusing a used book store, he came across the copy of the book for 3 bucks...couldn't have made a better buy that day...

enjoying walden right now...but the idea of simplify, simplify, simplify has found fertile ground in the doc's soil for years now...

feel bad that HDT only lived to 44 years of age...wonder what he would have come up with if he had lived even 10 more years...the doc is gonna turn 48 in february and he feels that this decade he has learned more than all the previous ones put together...

for thoreau to put it together so early in life is great...it took the doc a while longer to get to where he wants to be...

great to have someone come to the same conclusions as you have yourself about so many things in an independent manner so to speak...there's validation in that thought process even though you're still going against the grain of society...

a very important book for the doc to put into his collection...from that validation standpoint, especially...

this speaks to the doc, general lit posters...probably not too many of you attune yourselves to the beat of this drum, but the doc does...

I find it wholesome to be alone the greater part of the time. To be in company, even with the best, is soon wearisome and dissipating. I love to be alone. I never found the companion that was so companionable as solitude...

well the doc has finally meandered his way through the thoreau book...lots of things to comment on, but what the doc takes most from it is the enjoyment that both he and thoreau get from solitude...

and there aint nothing wrong w/ that, either...

the doc is back amongst the pines and lakes in the heart of lake culture again...putting the precepts of thoreau together in the doc's own inimitable style...

up every morning between six and seven a.m. and go out and collect the wood and stoke up a nice fire in the fire pit...

head back inside to put on a pot of water on the stove for the tea and then head back outdoors w/ a collection of books...right now, nietzsche, 'the idiot' and a henry a. wallace bio...

later the tea kettle will whistle and let the doc know it's time to fix that magical elixer of life...

the next couple of hours the doc spends reading in front of the fire...

here in the heartland right now it gets below freezing on these clear nites this early in the season, and the doc has chosen not to use the heater...

so after getting out of bed, he needs to warm up and the fire wood gathering and sawing a few logs does the trick...the fire keeps the warmth going until the sun does the trick by about nine a.m...

magestic blue skies, birds clattering and nary a vehicle to disturb the doc...

splendid isolation...the doc thinks that mr. thoreau would approve...

ROAR!

[virgo27]

Man, where do you live? I think Thoreau would approve.

[country doctor]

up here in the upper midwest...closer to canada then the iowa border...lake country...

this morning was the first that the doc's been up here that it wasn't reading 20 degrees on his deck...although the temperature reads a little low, when it reads 20 that means about 30 degrees fahrenheit...so, anyways, he was able to do his reading outside w/o the fire...warm enough to just wear a sweater and be very comfortable...afternoons are warming up nicely now and the doc wears t-shirts and shorts...

besides reading, the doc does lots of bike riding...no car and the closest town is 13 miles roundtrip...

over two hours of exercise each and every day unless on those rare occasions when it literally rains the whole day...and sometimes that doesn't stop the doc from his exercise fix...very rare day that he doesn't get out and about in the land of lakes and pines...

saw his first deer of the season yesterday...

ROAR!

[Buh4Bee]

Yup, Thoreau would approve!

[country doctor]

well the doc saw some nice animal sites lately up here in the land of pines and lakes...

on saturday he caught two baby foxes hiding out in the tall grass, but curious as to what the doc was up to...strangely, no mother around so hope all is gonna end well for the pups...

yesterday a baby fawn was running beside the doc when he was pedaling his bike...the fawn was running on the side of the road, in the ditch...the doc was on the road...but the little fella stayed up w/ the doc for about 50 yards before it cut back into the woods at the top of the hill...pretty neat to see, as that had never happened before...

then stepping out onto the deck last nite, what did the doc see but a doe staring straight up at him not 25 yards away...we had a stareoff for awhile, w/ the deer doing nothing but staring at the doc and twitching her ear...

finally after a couple of minutes the doc took a couple of steps forward and the doe moved into the woods...could still see it for another minute or so looking the doc's way from a hidden spot behind some trees...a few more steps forward and off she went deeper into the woods...

cool beans...

as for another disciple of thoreau? the doc read this weekend that charles lindbergh found inspiration in all of his work later in his life...he became lindbergh's 'god' according to the writer beginning in the late 1950's...

[PeterL]

i wonder what two weeks on the Concord and Nashua Rivers would be like now. I'll have to read that and laugh.

[G L Wilson]

In Australia, the true bushman hates the bush.

[country doctor]

right now it's turtle nesting season in the doc's neck of the woods...and accordingly the doc is doing his part to make sure that as many of these nesting turtles reach their destination as he sees...

it's disappointing when you come across a crushed turtle shell in the road and the department of natural resources asks that if you see a turtle crossing a road and you have the opportunity, pick them up and deliver them to the other side of the road on as straight a line as possible...of course, the optimum is letting the turtles cross the road on their own, but the doc has seen too many of them crushed on the roads to not help them out...here's the DNR's recommendations for others that might see a turtle this time of the year on a dangerous road...

* Maintain direction of travel if road crossing assistance is necessary. Turtles should be moved across roadways in as direct a line as possible, unless doing so would definitely put them in peril.



the doc's done this a couple of times this week...

he also saw the biggest snapping turtle he's ever seen already make it's destination on the other side of the road yesterday...it was huuggee!! looked almost like a tortoise...

other sights of nature that the doc saw this week was a raccoon that crossed his path...

the mosquitos and wood ticks are out in force as well...it's not all peaches and cream from mother nature...

[prickly_pete]

If we knew all the laws of Nature, we should need only one fact, or the description of one actual phenomenon, to infer all the particular results at that point.

Yeah, well, now that classical mechanics is dead we can pretty much throw that thought out the window.

I always thought Thoreau one of the more pretentious of the well known philosophers. Of course you'd see nature as some enchanting goddess - you're an Ivy League stuffed shirt, you never worked a day in your life. Sure, you went up to Walden and planted some beans for a few weeks, but if that didn't work you'd always have your money and blue blood to fall back on so you're not really 'living amongst the squirrels' as much as you might think.

Blanket statement about how life should be lived seems fairly ridiculous to me, but especially when they come from people who've never gone to bed hungry, never broken their backs for a measly living, never heard a single bullet whistle past their heads, etc....

[Rores28]

Does everyone know that pete was in Iraq, and regularly had bullets whizzing by his head?

Your welcome pete. Now you don't have to awkwardly inject that somewhere.

[prickly_pete]

I be up in the mix of action
While you're at home, on the couch relaxin'!!!

[IceM]

I always thought Thoreau one of the more pretentious of the well known philosophers. Of course you'd see nature as some enchanting goddess - you're an Ivy League stuffed shirt, you never worked a day in your life. Sure, you went up to Walden and planted some beans for a few weeks, but if that didn't work you'd always have your money and blue blood to fall back on so you're not really 'living amongst the squirrels' as much as you might think.

Blanket statement about how life should be lived seems fairly ridiculous to me, but especially when they come from people who've never gone to bed hungry, never broken their backs for a measly living, never heard a single bullet whistle past their heads, etc....

I agree, in that Thoreau, much as I admire his writing and powerful voice, is pretentious with his Walden experiment, but for different reasons as the quote I'm using. Thoreau maintained regular contact with friends, often inviting them over to share in the beauty of Walden lake. This kills the validity of the experiment for me. He certainly lives in circumstances that are distinct from the wealth and luxury he was afforded in Concord. That is indisputable. But the purity of the experiment is corrupted by visitors. How many visionary ideas may he have developed through isolation, entertaining none but thoughts, Nature, and those measly woodchucks? :brow:

Pete's distaste for "high" society misses the point here. How many impoverished individuals have the luxury to detach themselves from wealth and experience life without it? Thoreau had the luxury to experiment with life without wealth, and in doing so, crafted some wonderful philosophical ideas that may not have been generated without this experiment. Walden serves as a living testament to the beauty of Nature as seen through eyes dismissing the Concordian materialism. Simply because he had the luxury to embark on the minimalist journey doesn't suggest the results are invalid.


I be up in the mix of action
While you're at home, on the couch relaxin'!!!

For a war veteran, I'm finding your behavior more and more distasteful. You have a bitter disgust for "high" society which is becoming more and more inflammatory, and are now immaturely mocking people. I hope you reconsider how you address some of your peers.

[country doctor]

another week has gone by w/ the doc being in tune with his surroundings and nature...the deer seem to be popping out again more and more...he's ran into them on three different occasions this week...one day he came across a doe w/ her two fawns...she was the first to bolt into the woods...the fawns just stared at the doc before one and then the other went to catch up w/ mom...always a thrill to get up close to them...

the doc keeps having these words run through his brain these days while he's out there getting his exercise...

It is life near the bone, where it is sweetest.
- Henry David Thoreau

[G L Wilson]

You are classy, Rores28, for mocking a veteran because he is a veteran - real classy.

[mortalterror]

You are classy, Rores28, for mocking a veteran because he is a veteran - real classy.

I'd say he has an edge on kids who create multiple accounts on forums, and fabricate personas, to pretend to be something they are not.

[G L Wilson]

I'd say he has an edge on kids who create multiple accounts on forums, and fabricate personas, to pretend to be something they are not.

What multiple accounts? You libel me, sir. I will dispute you on logical grounds. What gives you reason to believe that I have multiple personalities? How could I have multiple accounts? What makes you think that these things are true of an honest person? I put these questions to you, sir, please answer them.

[country doctor]

it's time again for the doc to bring all the readers up to date w/ his latest communes w/ nature...

how many of the readers have seen a silver fox? well the doc has a pair of these rare creatures living practically in his back yard...right across the road must be where they make their home, because the doc has come across them numerous times right on that gravel road this summer...the first time he saw it, he didn't know what to make of the creature...it darted into the woods real quick and all the doc knew was that it wasn't a coyote and that all the foxes he ever had seen before were red ones...

but sure enough he talked w/ one of the old timers in his neck of the woods and was informed that there's a pair of silver foxes that are making their home right near the doc...

since then he's come across one or the other four more times...the last time the fox stared for quite awhile at the doc and the doc at he before he dove into the tall grass...