The Place Where There Is No Darkness

[Guernica]

Winston's dream about O'Brien saying that they would "meet in the place where there is no darkness" interested me. I am thinking that the darkness could represent the Party, Big Brother or any other controlling group, and that by their meeting could mean that the controlling group had been dissolved; or, that they would be meeting in a place where the controlling group could not intrude. Any other views?

[bazarov]

Agree.

[The Atheist]

Yep, a clear metaphor for the christian heaven.

[lukgem]

i agree to,but meet in a place where there is no light could also be symbolic of the enlightenment or illumination of mankind forward thinking in terms of freedom of will and science.voltaire and diderot where a big part of this movement leading into socialism i think with rousseau.this subject takes a lot of study and the encyclopedie was not even translated into english so that makes it even harder to look into.
could the statement also mean that they have come to terms with their fate and know that once they have become unorthodox they will both become an unperson,and death always leads us toward the light people say.

and hey,the place where there is no darkness is the ministry of love(no windows),that is why o'brien seems to register what winston says to him during their meeting at his abode,and does o'brien not allude to the fact when bringing sanity back to winston that he actually told him this in a dream seven years earlier?

[Enjoi.]

I think we are over evaluating this. I think this is foreshadowing of the Ministry of Love, as lukgem said the Ministry of Love does in fact have no windows. :lol:
I do agree with the other possibilities, but I don't know if Orwell was being symbolic or just foreshadowing.

[The Atheist]

I think we are over evaluating this. I think this is foreshadowing of the Ministry of Love, as lukgem said the Ministry of Love does in fact have no windows.

Actually, windows and darness have little to do with each other. Once the lights are switched off, it's dark.

[lukgem]

that is true athiest,but winston does guess at whilst in the ministry of love about what time he is getting his meals as there is no source of natural light. and he also says that he gets use to sleeping with bright lights on his face but it makes his dreams more vivid.is this not a common torture technique?i think it has been used in guantanamo?
please correct me if i am wrong sir.

[Enjoi.]

No windows in a symbolic sense. Though I contradict myself about the symbolism thing. No windows represents a coldness and a darkness. Darkness in the mind as well as in a physical sense.

[The Atheist]

that is true athiest,but winston does guess at whilst in the ministry of love about what time he is getting his meals as there is no source of natural light.

But does he base that on when he gets hungry or when the meals arrive? If someone with no idea of the time is served breakfast at 9 pm daily, they will soo see it as morning.


and he also says that he gets use to sleeping with bright lights on his face but it makes his dreams more vivid.is this not a common torture technique?i think it has been used in guantanamo?
please correct me if i am wrong sir.

Sleep deprivation has definitely been used as a means of torture, but I don't know about the bright lights causing vivid dreams. Gitmo has certainly used the bright light technique (http://humanrights.ucdavis.edu/projects/the-guantanamo-testimonials-project/testimonies/testimomies-of-lawyers/afghan-at-guantanamo-seeks-dismissal-of-charges), but as part of sleep deprivation.

Must try leaving the lights on for a few nights to see if it works.

:D