Is the soul inependent of the body?

[blazeofglory]

This is indeed a very tough question to answer and we can not find the exact answer we are seeking.

It is often said that the soul is immortal and the body is not. But this is proved wrong, for when the body is not maintained or not nourished for sometimes the soul leaves the body.

If the soul is really immortal and is independent it could have still have to hold the body.

There is no proof of the immortality of the soul, the type of the soul we are conditioned to beleive or our pundits hard-wire us into believing it.

This is a tough question.

[DapperDrake]

Indeed, this is really two questions though :-

What is the soul, i.e. how do we define it?

Does the soul survive the body?

To the first question I would say that the soul is that part of the human mind that is more than the sum of its parts - that's pretty vague but it's pretty much the best I can do.

To the second question I would answer no, if the soul survived the body it would have to be a seperate entity in its own right. yet it is painfully obvious that physical effects on the body esp. the brain impact our mind. If the soul was independant and viable in its own right then lobotomy and other radical brain surgerys should not affect the mind as thay do - i.e. remove cognitive function.

[NikolaiI]

The spirit soul is the frangmental spark of life which inhabits the body and gives it life and consciousness. The individual soul is very tiny, it exists in the heart of the living entity, and it is conscious of the whole body.

It is eternal and cannot be cut by any weapon, or destroyed. It's eternal, which means that there was never a time you or I, or any living being, did not exist, nor will there be a time when we will cease to. The body dies but the soul does not.

The body is like the outer covering of the soul. The soul is like the driver of the body. If I am in a very nice car, I might begin to associate with the car, but in fact I am not the car, but the driver of the car. Similarly, I am not this body, but the soul.

The soul is more subtle than the body, more subtle than the false ego, intelligence, and the mind. Ideally the soul should be the driver of the body; but if I have an uncontrolled mind then I am not in control. For instance my senses might control my mind. Then I am not in control but slaved to sense gratification. If the mind is controlled, then I can use it for what I wish. And above mind is intelligence, and higher is false ego, and highest is soul.

Part of self-realization involves controlling the senses, controlling the mind, becoming intelligent, etc.

Having achieved the highest part of self-realization, a fully self-realized person sees everything in relation to the soul. All living entities have the potential for spirituality, even trees or insects or bacteria. The soul of a human is not greater or lesser than any other soul; but we are humans because of our karma.

So is it separate? In a way. The body is like the coat or outer covering. Taking care of the body is not enough to save us. Christianity will tell you this as well as Hinduism. It will not help a drowning person to make sure their outer clothes are nice or well-mended. In the same way the soul is what is important; more important than the body.

To sum up, we are the soul, not the body. We're illusioned because all we have contact with is material nature, so that's what we think we are. It's said the first step to self-realization is realizing that we're not this body.

[blazeofglory]

We can put it differently for since the universal spirit pervades everything, everything is the universal soul and there is no distinction in substance between the two, the universal soul, and Nikolai said there the soul that holds the body is a small soul. In fact there is no smallness and bigness of the soul.

The soul is no physical entity at all, and it has little to do with bodily attributes.

If we really have to beleive in the soul based on what our scriptures hold God or soul is one and there is no duality, no Christian, no Mohammedan, no Hindu God. And God has little to do with our everyday reality and it is in everything, penetratingly.

[B-Mental]

I agree with Nikolai's well written answer...especially the following...

Having achieved the highest part of self-realization, a fully self-realized person sees everything in relation to the soul. All living entities have the potential for spirituality, even trees or insects or bacteria. The soul of a human is not greater or lesser than any other soul; but we are humans because of our karma.

All living things possess part of the universal soul. The soul exists on a plane which you cannot associate with your physical senses.

[NikolaiI]

The soul is the source of light, and it is intimately connected with God. Normally we are not fully realized of the self, we do not know the soul, but glimpses of the soul are revelation, transcendent. Glimpses of the soul are like illumination, and we can see the truth of statements like 'When the self arises, the world ceases, and when the world shows, the self hides from view.'

[RichardHresko]

Aquinas teaches that the soul is both that which gives form to the body and also that which partakes of the divine wisdom. The former portion dies with the body but will be resurrected. The latter survives death. This represents an attempt at comprimse between Aristotelianism (which argues death is ONLY the form of the body) and Christian doctrine. Aquinas in making this bridge acknowledges the intimate connection of body and soul and also that we in some ways transcend the physical.

[El Viejo]

This is indeed a very tough question to answer and we can not find the exact answer we are seeking.

About 100 years ago a Dr. McDougall conducted experiments to try to determine the weight of a soul.

Possibly inspired by Dr. M's experiments someone wrote a sci-fi story, probably published in Playboy, about scientists who devise a field in which they trap death as it comes to take a soul.

I think our soul is our brain: everything we're born with plus what we add. It all goes away when we die.

But until someone actually weighs a soul or traps it (or traps death) we've nothing but our suppositions.

[blazeofglory]

But it is really hard for me to infer as to what is truth as a matter of fact. There is nothing to prove there is no soul and no disproof to say there is no soul. In fact we orbit around series of confusion. Science has limitations of its own and it cannot see things beyond a periphery, and yet we can not disregard the idea that beyond that there is nothing or beyond a scientific periscopic domain there is nothing. I believe in the universal spirit or the universal soul. I do not take the universe is something dead or inanimate. I feel it is as animated and as spirited as we are. Therefore this article is not meant to make a conclusion. It is just open to ideas.

[El Viejo]

But it is really hard for me to infer as to what is truth as a matter of fact. There is nothing to prove there is no soul and no disproof to say there is no soul. In fact we orbit around series of confusion. Science has limitations of its own and it cannot see things beyond a periphery, and yet we can not disregard the idea that beyond that there is nothing or beyond a scientific periscopic domain there is nothing. I believe in the universal spirit or the universal soul. I do not take the universe is something dead or inanimate. I feel it is as animated and as spirited as we are. Therefore this article is not meant to make a conclusion. It is just open to ideas.

It's true, with respect to the soul we at this point have proved and can prove nothing. We're sort of like a Mousterian tribe, sitting 'round the fire debating the nature of the stars.

On the other hand, we can extrapolate from what we do know, which is a bit more than the Neanderthals knew.