Changing history.

[Taliesin]

Just a small question: if you could ..er... rearrange something in the history, what would it be? And why?

For example:
I wish that America were discovered about thirty years ago. Not that I am an anti-American, or something, but I am really interested what would have happened to the natives if their cultures could have evolved instead of being destroyed by invaders.

[ajoe]

I wish there had never been slavery. Assuming the majority of white people were Christians, I think it's very hypocritical of them to treat certain people like dirt while they're off praising God and praying at Church.

[subterranean]

Agree.

I wish politics or political science or what ever that is related to struggle for power which caused lots of wars, refugees, homeless people etc, had never been existed!

[crisaor]

Good question, and as such, I can't really answer it. Lots of possible events, and multiple outcomes. I guess it depends on the potential area of influence you can possess when dealing with history changing. Nevertheless, I believe that messing with this kind of stuff (yes, I know it's fictional, but even so) always has some kind of repercusions, so, if i did it, I'd only make some minor changes regarding my own existance... ;)

[subterranean]

what do you consider as minor changes? sometimes minor things are the triggers that caused big things. i mean imagine if Newton didnt sit under the apple tree, perhaps he wouldn't be recognized as today...

[poehee99]

If i could rearrange something in history it would be that in 1914 archduke Franz Ferdinand of the austro-Hungarian wasn't murdered, because this murder was the event that triggered the first world war and that resulted in the second world war and the still ongoing problems in kosovo and the middle east. It is strange to see that the killing of one man can have such a great influence on history.

[Taliesin]

I don't think that if Ferdinand had lived, the WW 1 had not happened. Everyone was allied with everyone and it needed just a little spark to make an explosion. If Ferdinand hadn't been shot, the spark would just have come from somewhere else.
There would have made had been peace for some months, but then another conflict would have lashed up between to countries, and they would have asked all of their "big buddies" to war too.

[crisaor]

what do you consider as minor changes? sometimes minor things are the triggers that caused big things. i mean imagine if Newton didnt sit under the apple tree, perhaps he wouldn't be recognized as today...
Sub, I meant really minor changes which are only related to my person. For example, I would tell myself to follow a certain path of conversation with a certain lady at a certain moment (and this was the first time alteration that slipped into my mind, I wonder why... :rolleyes:). Another one could be warning myself from bad incidents, but I guess all of that stuff pretty much makes you what you are, so the real change I'd make is the first one. :brow:

[verybaddmom]

didnt anyone here ever see "the butterfly effect"?

[ajoe]

My brother just rented it, but I never got around to watch it. :(
Is it the one where someone goes to the past and steps on a butterfly and then when he comes back to the present the alphabet changes?

[Amanah]

If i could rearrange something in history it would be that in 1914 archduke Franz Ferdinand of the austro-Hungarian wasn't murdered, because this murder was the event that triggered the first world war and that resulted in the second world war and the still ongoing problems in kosovo and the middle east. It is strange to see that the killing of one man can have such a great influence on history.

The Learned Elders of Zion have been in control for a long time. Maybe this triggered the war and maybe not. The world really is at a place of no return. It just can't be re-arranged, made different or get better. There is a website that really tells the truth about what is happening now, it is: http://www.the-editorial.com/blog/

[Taliesin]

My brother just rented it, but I never got around to watch it. :(
Is it the one where someone goes to the past and steps on a butterfly and then when he comes back to the present the alphabet changes?

Plus, with the time travels you have those problems about killing you grandfather. I have never understood why people want to kill them.

[Isagel]

There is actually a very good book with the same title as this thread, by Stephen Fry. I would really recommend it. It´s about what happens when a group of scientists makes it so that Hitler never was born.

[poehee99]

isn't the stephen fry book called Making History? it's on my books-to-read list. unfortunately this list is getting longer and longer. I need a holiday!

[Isagel]

Your right! It´s Making history. Sorry!

[Koa]

I don't think that if Ferdinand had lived, the WW 1 had not happened. Everyone was allied with everyone and it needed just a little spark to make an explosion. If Ferdinand hadn't been shot, the spark would just have come from somewhere else.
There would have made had been peace for some months, but then another conflict would have lashed up between to countries, and they would have asked all of their "big buddies" to war too.

I agree...the war(s) would have been different, but something like that sort of had to happen... And as for the problems in Kosovo and the Balcans, I don't think they could have been avoided... Well maybe they wouldn't have happened if Tito's policy was different, but I dont know enough about it to say it...and maybe even in that case, those problems would have developed anyway.

The first thing that came to my mind to answer to this thread was to erase world war II, but this is such a major change...nothing, not even a tiny aspect of life would be the same as it is now, if that didnt happen... Scary.
So maybe I'd change soemthing else...I'd erase the holocaust and the atomic bomb...quite useless, weren't they? (well ok the bomb kinda made Japan understand that it was better to stop resisting, but still... I cant see any 'reason' for the holocaust I guess...but hey, would Israel exist if it wasn't for that? Oh stop me, I love talking about history. I always tell myself I should read more books about history, but I still have a pile of fiction to finish...)

[subterranean]

Some things that I would really want to change from my life history is that I'd love to be born in London in the late 50's, then I'd have the chance to see live gigs of my all time fav bands (mostly Pink Floyd and Zeppelin)..

[baddad]

Change...one...thing.........?

The part of the human genome code that makes humans capable of animosity.....

[Koa]

Some things that I would really want to change from my life history is that I'd love to be born in London in the late 50's, then I'd have the chance to see live gigs of my all time fav bands (mostly Pink Floyd and Zeppelin)..

Oh if it's about that, I'd like to have been born in the 70s to enjoy the fabolous 80s!!! And in England, definitely!

[subterranean]

yeah the fabolous 80s..i was just a goofy elementary kid at that time :D

[nome1486]

I wasn't even that old, sadly. I love '80s music and '80s movies (Ferris Bueller, Back to the Future...these are modern classics). I probably wouldn't have enjoyed it that much at the time, but I think it would have been cool to have been a high school student in the late '80s or early '90s.

[verybaddmom]

yeah...i can assure you...not so much

[baddad]

.....I'll second that VBM. The 80's......pop music............yuccckkkk.

[amuse]

teehee. the 80's were much during the 80's. seemed like they'd go on forever.

[Koa]

Well, at the time we would have despised them of course... But now it feels there's so much to discover about the lovely decade...
And PLEASE baddad don't identify the 80s with pop music... Even if I happen to mostly enjoy those silly tunes too when I'm in the mood, I'm fed up with always hearing that 80s music is crap and void, cos there's a dark/clever side to the 80s which is what I love most in the world, and noone ever remembers about it.

[baddad]

...one thousand forgivenesses asked for, Koa. My own tastes in musical styles should not discount any type of music that others enjoy. Sure, it is a matter of taste, but beyond that, all music has value.......I wasn't thinking to clearly during the witching hour..........

[ajoe]

A disconnected random thought: I personally love the late 80s to early 90s even though I was too young to appreciate it. I like the clothes style (bellies showing everywhere are starting to irritate me), the music (especially Richard Marx's "Right Here Waiting" ;)), and just the conservatism in general.

What happened to the original topic "Changing History"?

[poehee99]

no-one has mentioned stalin here, so I would erase the presence of stalin from history

[Koa]

...one thousand forgivenesses asked for, Koa. My own tastes in musical styles should not discount any type of music that others enjoy. Sure, it is a matter of taste, but beyond that, all music has value.......I wasn't thinking to clearly during the witching hour..........
The rant wasn't for you baddad, I was just asking not to think only of the mainstream...and got carried away cos everytime I mention that I love the music of the 80s everyone thinks of the poppy stuff and think I'm demential... I guess that's what was most popular at the time and irritated people at the time like I dislike nowadays' pop, but it seems like that's the only thing left of the 80s, while some dark (and not dark) bands are still around and some still have a great number of fans, even young ones, despite having split up almost 20 years aho (thinking of The Smiths)... That sais, I do happen too to bash other people's musical taste so noone's innocent I guess, there's even a kind of music Im not able to respect (guess ;)) but then I don't think it should even be called music ;)

And yes everytime I see a movie of the 80s I feel like going out dressed like that (but I don't, don't worry ;)). As for what ajoe said, I didnt realise how much different the early 90s were from now until I happened to see a rerun of the first series of Beverly Hills 90210 (yes used to watch that crappy thingy :)) and they looked totally out of time :D

And thanks poehee to try and get back on topic :)

[subterranean]

.....I'll second that VBM. The 80's......pop music............yuccckkkk.

not really the pop...but those sweet rock stuffs...