PhD topic thread, take 2

[kratsayra]

I have been very absent due to my upcoming qualifying exams. But I just dropped in to relax a bit. I noticed a thread in "general literature" about finding a PhD topic. It perhaps had an odd start, but I thought it might be nice to commiserate with other people anyways. Not to ask the question "what should I write about" (I think I might actually have my topic!) but just to talk about the difficulties of coming up with a topic, and the anxiety around it.

The other day I told my adviser I wanted to think of something that could combine everything I was interested in. And he, very intelligently, told me that that was a bad idea. First of all, it would be too much to actually complete. And secondly, he suggested that I should save some of my interests for the rest of my academic career. Amazing advice. haha. :)

[Sancho]

I’ve never written a dissertation (and doubt that I could – so hats off to you) but every paper I’ve ever written, wound-up not even close to what I’d intended when I started it.

[jon1jt]

hey Kratsayra good luck with your research project. i remember you were teaching some time ago and had posted. how did teaching that class go? have you actually started the proposal yet? for me, that was the most difficult part. there were times i wanted to give it up and get on with my life. a proposal that amounted to just under 32 pages and took me two years! the proposal is really rough because the committee scrutinizes and returns it with requests. it's demoralizing having it handed back after all the work you invested, but that's just part of the process i came to learn.

the defense is mandatory, and i had to do oral and written comps as well. i become tired thinking about it, but in the end when you look back on the whole experience you realize the different person you were and how much your perspective developed those days and long after.

[Petrarch's Love]

Hi Kratsayra--I've got my exams in exactly a week and then will be just where you are...desperately seeking a dissertation topic. Your adviser sounds just like mine, who similarly told me recently to remember I had a whole long career in which to pursue the ideas I don't do in the dissertation. There are so many tempting things to write about! Must go back to exam prep. now, but we should commiserate some more as we go through the painful proposal portion (which Jon's post is making look more painful and forbidding by the moment!:p ). Back to the exam prep. for me just now.

P.S. I too was curious about that other thread that was started, and rather curious to see what sort of reply the OP might have given. Clearly wasn't someone at the dissertation stage. Perhaps someone contemplating going to grad. school and thinking ahead? We may never know.

[kratsayra]

sorry I posted and then disappeared. I'm back now.


hey Kratsayra good luck with your research project. i remember you were teaching some time ago and had posted. how did teaching that class go? have you actually started the proposal yet? for me, that was the most difficult part. there were times i wanted to give it up and get on with my life. a proposal that amounted to just under 32 pages and took me two years! the proposal is really rough because the committee scrutinizes and returns it with requests. it's demoralizing having it handed back after all the work you invested, but that's just part of the process i came to learn.

the defense is mandatory, and i had to do oral and written comps as well. i become tired thinking about it, but in the end when you look back on the whole experience you realize the different person you were and how much your perspective developed those days and long after.

I am teaching - my class is going alright. Next semester I need to be more mean and strict. That's what I've learned. ;) It's awfully fun though. My students always make me smile.

I haven't yet started the proposal. And, in fact, I'm not entirely sure what the proposal process will consist of for me - I'm going to wait till I've passed my exams (knock on wood) to find out the details.


Hi Kratsayra--I've got my exams in exactly a week and then will be just where you are...desperately seeking a dissertation topic. Your adviser sounds just like mine, who similarly told me recently to remember I had a whole long career in which to pursue the ideas I don't do in the dissertation. There are so many tempting things to write about! Must go back to exam prep. now, but we should commiserate some more as we go through the painful proposal portion (which Jon's post is making look more painful and forbidding by the moment!:p ). Back to the exam prep. for me just now.



Oh we are in just the same spot! Good luck. :)

I'm really excited to do a proposal. After reading and reading so much I'm kind of glad that I will finally get to start doing something that feels more productive. But that's probably because I haven't actually started work on a proposal yet.

I'm so concerned that my idea will not be current enough. I know that sounds silly, but sometimes things seem to move so fast so an idea that sounds interesting suddenly could be old news in a few months. eek!

[jon1jt]

the proposal's chapters summary section was, in my mind, the most grueling part of the project. The problem (challenge?!) is that you will not nearly have exhausted reading all the literature and yet the committee EXPECTS that you will be able to speak authoritatively about your topic, section by section.

Re what Krats said about being more mean. Students tend to take advantage of a lenient professor, that's the way it is. It's never personal. My best classes turned out to be those in which the professor set the bar high from day one and demonstrated an effortless enthusiasm for their subject and spoke with the sense that it MATTERED.

Live your life, watch cartoons, rebel, quit now! :) (just kidding!)

[Petrarch's Love]

I haven't yet started the proposal. And, in fact, I'm not entirely sure what the proposal process will consist of for me - I'm going to wait till I've passed my exams (knock on wood) to find out the details.
Oh, your first post made it sound like you might be done with the exams. Good luck to you on your exams too then! I'm sure you'll do swell. :)


I'm really excited to do a proposal. After reading and reading so much I'm kind of glad that I will finally get to start doing something that feels more productive. But that's probably because I haven't actually started work on a proposal yet.

I feel exactly the same way. My head is sort of bursting with this huge amount of reading I've been doing, and I'm really excited to start thinking about a project. Though, like you I have this feeling that it may look a little more difficult when I'm actually trying to do it. Ah well, I'll hang onto this bright eyed sanguine stage for as long as possible.



I'm so concerned that my idea will not be current enough. I know that sounds silly, but sometimes things seem to move so fast so an idea that sounds interesting suddenly could be old news in a few months. eek!

I think all grad. students worry about that sometimes (which is a sad fact no doubt worthy a dissertation length study in and of itself), but I've decided that I am going to throw concerns about how "current" my ideas are out the window for the moment and just get some good solid thinking in about my poets and the crit. that's been done on them. I feel like if I start worrying about what's current it will lead to trendy ideas that really will be old news in a few months. I also think worrying about what's "in" could really paralyze my thinking process and end up making me more concerned about fussing with somebody else's theory than actually saying something about the literature. We'll see how that goes.


Re what Krats said about being more mean. Students tend to take advantage of a lenient professor, that's the way it is. It's never personal. My best classes turned out to be those in which the professor set the bar high from day one and demonstrated an effortless enthusiasm for their subject and spoke with the sense that it MATTERED.

I agree, Jon. Like Krat, I'm a beginning teacher, and I've definitely found that the thing that has improved my teaching experience most is making my expectations very clear and pretty demanding. The enthusiasm for the subject part comes naturally, of course, and I must say I think the biggest pay off in teaching is those moments when your own enthusiasm becomes contagious and you start seeing it reflected in the students. Makes it all worth it.


Live your life, watch cartoons, rebel, quit now! (just kidding!)

Quit? Never sir! But I do intend to spend an entire month after my exam watching cartoons (or something equivalent). The mind must needs lie fallow a time ere it can bear sweet fruit.

[kratsayra]

Oh, your first post made it sound like you might be done with the exams. Good luck to you on your exams too then! I'm sure you'll do swell. :)

I'm partially done. In this liminal space (sorry, I couldn't help myself . . .) where I've finished my written exam and haven't done my oral exam.


I think all grad. students worry about that sometimes (which is a sad fact no doubt worthy a dissertation length study in and of itself), but I've decided that I am going to throw concerns about how "current" my ideas are out the window for the moment and just get some good solid thinking in about my poets and the crit. that's been done on them. I feel like if I start worrying about what's current it will lead to trendy ideas that really will be old news in a few months. I also think worrying about what's "in" could really paralyze my thinking process and end up making me more concerned about fussing with somebody else's theory than actually saying something about the literature. We'll see how that goes.

It's very true. Ideally, it's probably best to chose something you really like and feel comfortable with. I just still keep worrying . . .

[SleepyWitch]

Hi girls,
I need your advice on whether to take a PhD at all. I've been thinking about this for ages but I can't make up my mind. The situation is a bit complicated, so I'll give you the details first. Sorry to bore you with such a long-winded explanation, but at the moment the situation at German univs is somewhere between chaos and Armaggedon.

1. Sleepy's background
I'm studying English and Geography to become a teacher. I.e. after I graduate I can take teacher training at a German school and teach those two subjects.
At the moment I'm writing my graduation thesis in English Linguistics. This is the equivalent to an M.A. thesis in page count and scope, except it's for people who are studying to be a teacher and I will not be allowed to call myself M.A.
My prof wants me to take a PhD, but I'm in more than two minds about it.
I've worked as a student tutor for +/- three years and I like teaching at univ. I could imagine teaching courses beyond the basic level. I think I'd both enjoy it and be capable of it. But I'm not too sure about the research and thesis part. If I'm given a topic I'll normally find it interesting and will work hard on it (eventually). I got As on all my term papers in English, so I guess that means I'm good. Plus, the prof keeps prodding me to take a PhD and I think he knows what he's talking about. But I'm not good at coming up with ideas and questions for research myself, plus I don't think it will be the end of the world if I don't become a Linguist.


2. Sod the Government
at the moment, the government is bleeding univs to death with saving measures.
There used to be a univ post called 'assistant' (=research assistant), which is limited to 6 years and is intended for people who want to take a PhD and teach/work at univ at the same time.
But the government is secretely phasing this kind of position out in favour of temp jobs for ppl who already have a PhD. This kind of temp job means that your contract has to be renewed every half year to 2 years and it's not up to the prof who hires you to decide about that. If the government decides it's OK for seminars/courses to be 50 to 80 students due to staff shortages (I'm talking about courses, not lectures), then that's how it'll be done.
Those temp guys are expected to already have a PhD and teach up to 18 hours a week at 1,600 Euros a month. If 2 hours of lessons take 9 hours of preparations, that means nearly 100 hours of work per week during term. A counter girl at a baker's shop makes 1,800 Euros a month for 40 hours a week.
There also used to be a post that's equivalent to something like assistant professor/associate professor, which is a life-long post you could get after you finished your PhD. But the government are replacing this with the same temp. posts as well, because life tenure costs money. This pays between 3, 000 and 4,000 Euros.
Now back to the research assistant thingy. As the government is cutting down on those, you're lucky if you can get 1/2 or 1/4 an assistantship, which means 1,000 Euros a month.
The other alternative is to apply for a scholarship. This is totally out of the question for me, because a) I'm fed up with cadging money off others and b) if you get a scholarship, the prof will give whatever assistant's job he can offer to someone else because he doesn't have enough of them to go around.
This happened to a friend of mine who got fired in favour of another girl.
c) I don't want to sit around working on my PhD thesis, living off a scholarship and not teaching anyone or being useful in some small way to anyone except myself ---> I NEED the assistant job.
My prof said "You know what the situation's like. But I'm glad you're interested". Which means, IF there should be jobs around at the time I graduate, he would give me a job, but all he can do is sit and wait.
But even if I could get the assistants job, after my PhD I'd probably end up as a temp, teaching 18 hours a week for a salary that's less than that of a shop assistant. Plus, I wouldn't have any free time. Which probably doesn't matter, because I wouldn't have any money to travel, go to the theatre or buy and house and raise children anyway.
I know this all sounds very materialistic, but what's the point in working your *ss off at uni when you could earn the same money in a blue-collar job and have some free time left to enjoy life on top?

3. Sleepy's plans
at the moment, there are 3 scenarios
1. take a PhD. see above

2. do teacher training in Germany. advantage: once you're a qualified teacher, you really rake it in, you get to do meaningful work etc.
disadvantage: teacher training takes two years, you have to have accomodation in two different places because the first half year is in one place, the middle year in another, and the last half year in the original place. salary: 900 Euros, at the end of those two years, you have to sit the same bloody Education final exams again that you already do at univ (they're all set by one and the same government) :eek2:

3. become a German teacher in England
advantages: nobody there wants to learn German anyway, so I'll have very small classes :)
they are desperately looking for native speakers of foreign languages, so they'll give you a welcome check for 2,500 pounds after your training
training takes one year, as opposed to two in Germany
if I'm very lucky, I'll even have some free time
disadvantages: none, except that I'll be bored stiff with teaching German after 2 years


so what do you think?
I think England is the best option, but I know I'll regret whatever decision I take for the rest of my life. If it had queens and kings in it, it'd be a tragedy.

[Virgil]

Sleepy - How long will it take to complete your PhD? Are you earning a living now? How long can you go without a decent paycheck? Universities in the US put potential students through the ringer. Most are in their mid to upper twenties and without the help of family have to live like thy're in poverty. And then even after all that, the pay isn't exactly overwhelming. Perhaps I'm just cynical but I haven't seen the value of it. And then what about your personal life? You had mentioned marriage. Can that and having children be put on hold? Is all they make you do and sacrifice worth it? Just questions to ponder. You don't have to answer them.

[SleepyWitch]

Sleepy - How long will it take to complete your PhD? Are you earning a living now? How long can you go without a decent paycheck? Universities in the US put potential students through the ringer. Most are in their mid to upper twenties and without the help of family have to live like thy're in poverty. And then even after all that, the pay isn't exactly overwhelming. Perhaps I'm just cynical but I haven't seen the value of it. And then what about your personal life? You had mentioned marriage. Can that and having children be put on hold? Is all they make you do and sacrifice worth it? Just questions to ponder. You don't have to answer them.

hehee, those are very good questions Virgil.
I'm earning 290 Euros a month as a student tutor now and my dad pays the rent and gives me an allowance. it's just about enough to scrape a living, but if three of my friends have a birthday the same month, I'm in a tight spot.
My dad is affluent but insupportive. Ever since my first term at univ the first question he asks when he phones me is "when are you finally going to graduate". If he had his way, I'd have been married to an imaginary Arab oil sheik ten years ago. He already made it clear I won't see a dime out of his purse if I should take a PhD.

[papayahed]

Hey Sleepy, I think you should do all three.:D

There's no reason why you couldn't do the teaching thing first then possibly if you find it necessary go for a PhD. And perhaps while teaching you can save up some dough to live comfortably while doing the PhD.

[SleepyWitch]

Hey Sleepy, I think you should do all three.:D

There's no reason why you couldn't do the teaching thing first then possibly if you find it necessary go for a PhD. And perhaps while teaching you can save up some dough to live comfortably while doing the PhD.

:thumbs_up yeah, I've thought about that :) I think that's what I'll eventually do.

[Virgil]

hehee, those are very good questions Virgil.
I'm earning 290 Euros a month as a student tutor now and my dad pays the rent and gives me an allowance. it's just about enough to scrape a living, but if three of my friends have a birthday the same month, I'm in a tight spot.
My dad is affluent but insupportive. Ever since my first term at univ the first question he asks when he phones me is "when are you finally going to graduate". If he had his way, I'd have been married to an imaginary Arab oil sheik ten years ago. He already made it clear I won't see a dime out of his purse if I should take a PhD.

:lol: Your dad and i may have a lot of things in common. :D

[SleepyWitch]

:lol: Your dad and i may have a lot of things in common. :D

haha, well he's an engineer, too. but otherwise, you're a nicer person on average :)

[Petrarch's Love]

Sleepy--Just my opinion, but in all seriousness it does not sound like the PhD is the best option for you. I'm sure that you are brainy and talented enough to do it, but having the ability is only part of the deal. It has to be something you really, really want for yourself because you'll have to have that deep seated desire to draw on during those times when you're sick of sacrificing money, social life etc., and yes, there are a lot of sacrifices involved, your time being the hardest one to make sometimes. It does mean having to put off things like having a family, and it sounds like in your case especially it would mean a very meager income (and no, it isn't materialistic to think about the money angle; it's just being practical and realistic). The PhD is a long haul, and not only is it not worth it unless it's really a dream of yours, but you're simply not going to stick it out unless the drive to do it is coming from you yourself rather than urgings from an outside source.

Now, I personally am quite happy in my program, and there are a lot of very rewarding things about the PhD, but I accentuate the negative above because I know that if deep down this really is what you want to do more than anything else then you'll ignore the negatives and blithely forge ahead to meet the challenges (I know I certainly received similar, possibly even more dire, warnings and was none-the-less determined to go for it). On the other hand, if you really don't want this all that much, then I think you should know that it is perfectly reasonable to be wary of all the things you foresee being problems, and that you won't really be missing some wonderful and enlightening academic experience if you don't go for a PhD, because it's only going to be wonderful and enlightening if your heart is truly in it. I personally am all for the go teach in England option. Sounds great! But, of course, it's all up to you. Incidently, you're always welcome on the PhD thread as an unofficial independent scholar, even if you don't become a mad doctoral candidate yourself (did I forget to mention the possibility of going mad in a PhD program? That's an important one to keep in mind. :D )



I think England is the best option, but I know I'll regret whatever decision I take for the rest of my life. If it had queens and kings in it, it'd be a tragedy.
:lol: Alas poor Sleepy, I knew her Horatio, a woman of infinite jest before she went into a PhD program! Wanted to quickly respond to this. For heaven's sake, don't you dare go around regretting things for the rest of your life. Regrets take up the time you could be using to just do all three like Papayahead suggests, or to enjoy the happy fruits of the decision you did make. If it's the wrong decision it's changeable. If it's a good decision that leads to happy life, then that's good. Don't worry; be happy! :)

[Petrarch's Love]

Just a note to Krat, not sure if you look at the boast post section, but I announced there that I recently passed my exams. Hopefully you are doing as well with yours. When you're all the way done we'll have to turn this into the PhD party thread for at least a few weeks before we try to make our minds think again. :banana: :banana: :banana:

[kratsayra]

Sleepy--Just my opinion, but in all seriousness it does not sound like the PhD is the best option for you. I'm sure that you are brainy and talented enough to do it, but having the ability is only part of the deal. It has to be something you really, really want for yourself because you'll have to have that deep seated desire to draw on during those times when you're sick of sacrificing money, social life etc., and yes, there are a lot of sacrifices involved, your time being the hardest one to make sometimes. It does mean having to put off things like having a family, and it sounds like in your case especially it would mean a very meager income (and no, it isn't materialistic to think about the money angle; it's just being practical and realistic). The PhD is a long haul, and not only is it not worth it unless it's really a dream of yours, but you're simply not going to stick it out unless the drive to do it is coming from you yourself rather than urgings from an outside source.



Yeah - this is what I was going to say. ;) Although I probably wouldn't have said it as eloquently.

The bottom line I think is that if you aren't overjoyed with the idea of pursuing your own line of research than you probably wouldn't be happy in a PhD program. And you should chose it for YOU, not because your professor wants you to do it.

And you can definitely do a combination of your choices, if you change your mind later, as Papaya says. Make some money teaching or whatever right now. And if after a few years you are sick of just teaching and want to be producing your own research as well, then you will know that maybe you should be doing a PhD.

. . . and now I'm off to the "boast post" thread to congratulate Petrarch.

[Virgil]

haha, well he's an engineer, too. but otherwise, you're a nicer person on average :)

Thanks. German engineer, from an older generation, probably very disciplined. I know the type. ;)

[SleepyWitch]

Thanks. German engineer, from an older generation, probably very disciplined. I know the type. ;)

hahaha, well he's not your blond, polo-shirt wearing, muscular Hans if that's who you have in mind :) disciplined when it comes to work, yep, but apart from that my dad's a big kid

[SleepyWitch]

hey girls,
I've told my prof I'd rather not take a PhD and he said it's OK and I could come back after one or two years in England if I change my mind :D
It feels really good to be rid of this problem because it totally confused and blocked me. Now I can study for my exams and don't need to worry about anything :)
thanks for your help :)

[kratsayra]

That's great Sleepy. :) And thanks for the update! I imagine I'd feel quite nervous if I was going to be telling one of my professors that I wasn't going to do something I thought they wanted me to do.

So I take it you are planning to teach in England after you're done, then?

[Petrarch's Love]

Good for you, Sleepy! I bet your time in England will be amazing! Can't wait to hear the adventures.

[Petrarch's Love]

As long as we're here on a PhD thread, thought I'd ask Krat how things are going with the proposal stage? I've been reading a great deal and narrowing things down, but nothing written down in any formal manner yet. I'm finding the exploration exhilarating though. Perhaps things have progressed more quickly and concretely on your end?

[vheissu]

hey girls,
I've told my prof I'd rather not take a PhD and he said it's OK and I could come back after one or two years in England if I change my mind :D
It feels really good to be rid of this problem because it totally confused and blocked me. Now I can study for my exams and don't need to worry about anything :)
thanks for your help :)

Well, I know it's different areas and all, but my current project supervisor told me it took her 3 years after her first degree to make a decision and apply for a PhD. She's now a group leader at the institute so I guess it turned out pretty well for her.

I have no intention of starting one in the next academic year. Just the thought of it scares me. S
Some of my friends got really disappointed when they were rejected after applying. One of them was even told that the reason he wasn't accepted was a) lack of substantial experience, which is ridicoulous to ask for when you're just about to graduate. b) He hadn't published anything yet! Published an article at the age of 22?!

[kratsayra]

As long as we're here on a PhD thread, thought I'd ask Krat how things are going with the proposal stage? I've been reading a great deal and narrowing things down, but nothing written down in any formal manner yet. I'm finding the exploration exhilarating though. Perhaps things have progressed more quickly and concretely on your end?

My department is somewhat of an aberration, I think, in that the proposal is only 5 pages long and thus not very scary. It is supposed to be done within the first month of the semester after you do your exams. Since I did my exams in December, that didn't give me much time. I wanted to get my proposal done within the allotted time frame so I finished it in February. I did know what I wanted to do by then, although it probably could have been framed in a more sophisticated manner. My adviser seemed a bit dissatisfied with my proposal, although when someone else on my committee finally got a chance to look at it he was like "this sounds great!"

What is the process for your proposal, Petrarch? I know for some departments, doing the proposal is almost like another exam.

It wasn't too hard for me to figure out my topic once I identified a couple of books that seemed to work together. But now I'm actually supposed to be doing real work on a chapter, and that is totally mystifying me. I emailed my adviser a pretty demanding calendar for completing my dissertation that I now want to take back and make easier. I know one woman who has been working on her first chapter for over a year. What if I need that long, and not a few months?! :eek:

[SleepyWitch]

That's great Sleepy. :) And thanks for the update! I imagine I'd feel quite nervous if I was going to be telling one of my professors that I wasn't going to do something I thought they wanted me to do.

So I take it you are planning to teach in England after you're done, then?

yep. I want to become a German teacher in England after I graduate, but I can only start in September 2009. my exams drag on from August through November/December of this year and the interviews for England are only in May 2009. :(



One of them was even told that the reason he wasn't accepted was a) lack of substantial experience, which is ridicoulous to ask for when you're just about to graduate. b) He hadn't published anything yet! Published an article at the age of 22?!
yep, that is ridiculous. My boyfriend read a job advert that said "requirements: university degree; desirable: list of publications". Normally, university degree means BA/BSc etc, MA, or some weird German degrees. Obviously, someone with an MA doesn't normally have a list of publications, unless they are taking a PhD and have published some articles in journals. In this case they wouldn't usually be applying for a full time job.
So my boyfriend phoned the secretary with that company and asked: "What kind of degree do you mean? What about those publications? It's not normal for M.A.s to have published anything?". So the woman says "Just any degree, not necessarily a PhD. Yes, some M.A.s have a list of publications". grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr :flare:

[kratsayra]

yep. I want to become a German teacher in England after I graduate, but I can only start in September 2009. my exams drag on from August through November/December of this year and the interviews for England are only in May 2009. :(


Aww, that's too bad. Maybe after your exams are all over you can get some vacation/relaxation time in there. :)

[Petrarch's Love]

My department is somewhat of an aberration, I think, in that the proposal is only 5 pages long and thus not very scary. It is supposed to be done within the first month of the semester after you do your exams. Since I did my exams in December, that didn't give me much time. I wanted to get my proposal done within the allotted time frame so I finished it in February. I did know what I wanted to do by then, although it probably could have been framed in a more sophisticated manner. My adviser seemed a bit dissatisfied with my proposal, although when someone else on my committee finally got a chance to look at it he was like "this sounds great!"

What is the process for your proposal, Petrarch? I know for some departments, doing the proposal is almost like another exam.

It wasn't too hard for me to figure out my topic once I identified a couple of books that seemed to work together. But now I'm actually supposed to be doing real work on a chapter, and that is totally mystifying me. I emailed my adviser a pretty demanding calendar for completing my dissertation that I now want to take back and make easier. I know one woman who has been working on her first chapter for over a year. What if I need that long, and not a few months?!

5 pages? I'm transferring to your department. :lol: Our proposal doesn't have any official process as such (which in some ways is what makes it a challenge), but there's a fairly high expectation for what you're supposed to come up with. It needs to be about twenty pages, starting with an explanation of the current critical/theoretical state of the field in relation to your chosen topic and your intervention in the critical discussion. Then you further describe your idea and justify what contribution your idea is going to make to the field, followed by an outline detailing the argument of each of the chapters and concluding with a summation of how the chapters fit together. In addition you also need to include an extensive bibliography to show that you've either read or plan to read the important books related to the topic. So basically it's like writing a book introduction before you've written the book. :p The good thing about this format is that I think I'll be in really good shape to type out the first chapter when the time comes, because I'll have been required to really think through the critical argument, the shape of each of the chapters, and the necessary reading ahead of time. My time line right now is to get the proposal out by the end of this quarter and to do the first chapter over the summer. We'll see how that goes...

Maybe your department and mine just have opposite sites of anxiety. Here it's the proposal that takes about a year sometimes (I'm determined not to have it take that long in my case, though!) and the first chapter goes pretty quickly, whereas it sounds like the first chapter is the sticking point for your colleagues. Sounds like you're off to a good start, though, and I have a sense you're not going to need that much time. What books are you working with for your project?

[Petrarch's Love]

Well, I know it's different areas and all, but my current project supervisor told me it took her 3 years after her first degree to make a decision and apply for a PhD. She's now a group leader at the institute so I guess it turned out pretty well for her.

I have no intention of starting one in the next academic year. Just the thought of it scares me. S
Some of my friends got really disappointed when they were rejected after applying. One of them was even told that the reason he wasn't accepted was a) lack of substantial experience, which is ridicoulous to ask for when you're just about to graduate. b) He hadn't published anything yet! Published an article at the age of 22?!

Being turned down for grad school because he hadn't published and didn't have experience? Experience in what? That's unheard of, at least in the humanities. What field is he in? I know some programs in the sciences do require experience and publication (i.e. basically don't want someone right out of undergrad), because publication is generally much easier in those fields and because they feel outside lab experience is important. For a PhD program in English or History I can't possibly imagine what sort of experience one would need to go into a post graduate program, aside from a good background in the field during one's undergraduate education.

[SleepyWitch]

Aww, that's too bad. Maybe after your exams are all over you can get some vacation/relaxation time in there. :)

thanks :) now that the silly PhD hassle is out of the way, I'll try and enjoy my exam preparation as much as possible :) as for vacation time, I'm not too sure there'll be much chance of that (financially), but you never know :)