War and Peace

[ben]

Just finished this, anybody else get through it or did they die trying?

Actually did find some of the characters Tolstoy created fantastic, namely Natasha. And talk about scope of human experience and emotion, i thought it captured so much. Shame about the battle descriptions which at times dragged on for pages and pages, and as for the second epilogue i skimmed it as it's just Tolstoy reflecting / yabbering / talking history etc... Some interesting themes in the book too. Well?

[amuse]

i'm just now picking it up again. and had stopped reading it because the battle scenes were better than the "parlor crap." (just an opinion.) :D

[ben]

The actual descriptions of the battles in terms of where the characters were and what they were doing wasn't what i disliked. It was just when Tolstoy was going on about the left flank being here, and settling here, and how it should have attacked from this point! It seemed like you needed a map to go with it!

[amuse]

i liked that! teehee. no wonder people can't remember i'm a girl. seriously, after reading stuff about the civil war, i wouldn't want to read w&p if it didn't have that - i love knowing exactly where everyone is, and exactly how a battle is set up then it's just like being there in the fray - so so important.
i think it's like being a general or a zillion troops or something, only we get an even better better view and can say great positioning, etc. or what the hell were they thinking? can't they see what i can see. it's like having hindsight right then and there. :D only way too late.

yeah, the map would've been nice. :D

[papayahed]

I've just picked it up again. I started this damn book so long ago I forgot who and what everybody was about so i had to start over. :brickwall I think I'm just about to the first battle scene. I have to admit I generally skim all the battle and technical scenes in books.

[amuse]

oh, goody, let's discuss it as we go along, shall we?

btw, ben, did you read it all at once or no?

[papayahed]

ok, I need a reason to keeping reading it. I've just finished the chapter where they blew up the first (or only) bridge.

[ravana]

I started reading it but can't finish because of my exams. And now can't remember what prevented me to continue reading. All what I remember was plenty of French phrases through Russian texts and I often had to look up for their meanings. In general Napoleon’s attack to Russia rescued Russian language from authority of French. I think in this way Tolstoy could reflect the great influence of French language in life of Russian aristocracy.
I should go on with reading it. Thanks Ben, for mention about that.

[amuse]

where is that, papayahed? i left off reading after Kozlovsky and Prince Andrei were to "draw up a memorandum to account for our not moving forward."
(p. 139; penguin classic.)
course, i had to start from the beginning this time 'round. yerp.

[Koa]

There has been at least 2 other discussions on W&P here, I'd advise looking for them cos I'm too lazy to repeat all my opinions on it ;) ;) ;)

I hated most of the characters, and particularly Natasha. Most of them seemed fake, stereotyped, and Natasha irritated me, she looks like a wannabe-clever little slut to me...

The battles and thoughts on war draw endlessly like an agony, repeating the same concepts again and again and again...

It was worth reading, to from my own opinion on it, but I can't say I appreciated it much, and I have my points on it. Btw I loved the French parts, I like to practise ;) But I can see they're a wall for people who don't know it... I've been told that in the Chinese translation the French part are in English, cos it feels the same: the language of a foreing country culturally predominant...

EDIT: Auntie Koa found the links to the old threads:
http://www.online-literature.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1497&highlight=peace

http://www.online-literature.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2144&highlight=peace

[ben]

Natasha didn't come across to me like that, she seemed more of a free spirit. Lot's of the Novel is so constrained and concerned with social custom etc... I thought it was good for somebody to in a way reject this or bend it slightly. She never charms men calculating or by being anything other than herself, that's why i think people were so attracted to her. She's obviously naive - running off with Antole but i don't think she was in any way a wannabe. Just an opinion.

It's interesting most of the characters seemed fake to you, a lot were based on real people in Tolstoy's family.

I had a look at the old links, there's some good stuff in them. Cheers

btw amuse, yeah all at once excepting the odd day off to keep sanity

[papayahed]

I'm on Chapter 14, Book 2. Prince Andrei has just returned to the battle after being sent to Brunn to report to Emperor Franz.

[amuse]

407 down, 1000+ to go. somewhere in the last week got on a roll. leaving a summer job'll do that to you. some very clever phrases, love tolstoy's use of common barnyard imagery - "girl dancing like a goat...baby grunting/squealing...collecting like rye in a shovel," his use of humor, his ability to share someone's thoughts as if inviting us to think along; i found one instance only where he threw me off, and i was briefly unsure if i were reading or thinking along with rostov. as before, i enjoy the battle scenes, even found myself afraid of me/certain characters dying at one point. the parlor crap is so much better this time around - well it improves later in the book. spoiler: loved the part where andrei's lise is in labor, and he runs up the stairs with the doctor; such a miraculous scene, so natural, beautiful, and still believable - really expected them to live happily ever after :( beautifully offhand pathos...and i must say, though he is long gone and unable to hear me: dammit, sir, why did you hide such choice morsels behind a miserable facade of 100 primary stultifying pages?

anyway, am loving the book. LOVING IT. furthermore, i find it more riveting than anna karenina. :eek:!

wish school wasn't to begin soon. i recently checked out beloved by morrison, and a margaret atwood: wilderness tips. but i digress.

[papayahed]

I have to admit I did get wrapped up in the part where Lise went into labor also. I've gotten a little passed that but not much further.

[amuse]

:) do keep going - i'd shelved it for weeks at a time this summer, but just finished vol. I - my goodness, so well worth the read.

[Jack_Aubrey]

I have an unusual interest in reading war and peace. I am currently half way through Tolstoy's Ressurection. Although off the selected topic I highly recommend it.

[papayahed]

I'm in the middle of the debate between Pierre and Prince Andrei. Pretty interesting.

[papayahed]

I've gotten to book III, I have to admit it's getting pretty interesting, especially the whole Natasha/Prine Andrei thing; and I'm still trying to figure out why Pierre is still with Ellen??? It boggles the mind.

[vango]

i'm starting to read it too. but in chinese.
i once tried it 2 years ago. but after 2 volumes (4 volumes in all), i throwed it away. it's too long, although it's pretty interesting. i had something else to do. but several days ago, i thought of it, and i thought i had to finish it. anyway it's a great book.

[papayahed]

I finished, I finished!!!!!! Whoo Hooo!!!!!!!! So, is there like a secret society or something I could join? Secret handshake? anything? :banana: :banana:

[baddad]

Yes Papayahed, there is a secret club and I, poor soul, will never be a member, having collapsed at the 850 page range. And no, I don't believe there is a secret handshake. However, I believe there will be a luncheon in the parlour........

[fayefaye]

lol, yes, let's form a secret society of finished war and peacers! :D we'll have our own esoteric little society.... it'll be interesting. no wait, that other thing. Tedious.

Can anybody tell I'm a third of the way through three month summer holidays and I still don't have a job so I've spent lotsa time watching Futurama? :D

[Scheherazade]

*starts a club for those who haven't finished 'War and Peace'*
Bet our club will prove more popular :D

[papayahed]

Wait, Scher, your club does sound like more fun........

haha just kidding I didn't finish War and Peace. Who's Pierre? I don't know any Natashas......

[Scheherazade]

*offers Papaya a shiny membership badge which reads 'I have NOT read W&P'*
For a moment there I was worried that you have decided to mix with the 'clever' ones... I am glad you are back with us :p Imagine all those serious highbrow literary discussions you would have to endure...
*shudders at the thought*

[OceanSoul]

*starts a club for those who haven't finished 'War and Peace'*
Bet our club will prove more popular :D


Can I join?? HEhe. I started War and Peace a couple of weeks ago...but haven't got very far yet...

[Taliesin]

Wait, Scher, your club does sound like more fun........

haha just kidding I didn't finish War and Peace. Who's Pierre? I don't know any Natashas......

We knew it.
It is not possible to finish that book. There is probably some kind of magic in work. Or maybe it is a law of physics, like Newtons Fourth Law. So, when someone sayhs that he has finished WAP, don't believe him. He is probably very intelligent or a liar. Which one is more probable, We ask you?

But We know a Natasha. She lives on the fourth floor. :nod:

[Scheherazade]

Can I join?? HEhe. I started War and Peace a couple of weeks ago...but haven't got very far yet...

As long as you promise never to finish it Ocean :p

[papayahed]

We knew it.
It is not possible to finish that book. There is probably some kind of magic in work. Or maybe it is a law of physics, like Newtons Fourth Law. So, when someone sayhs that he has finished WAP, don't believe him. He is probably very intelligent or a liar. Which one is more probable, We ask you?

But We know a Natasha. She lives on the fourth floor. :nod:

I thought Luka lived on the fourth floor.


OK, OK I skipped a few pages here and there when war statagies were being discussed. Sheesh, I'd rather be in a police interegation.....you guys are tough.

*shudders* at the thought of high brow discussions, where's the group that talks about farting??

[Scheherazade]

There is a group about that???? And why haven't I been informed all these months????

[papayahed]

that's what I'm asking? If there isn't one maybe we should form one.

[Taliesin]

This reminds Us the ADFW society (Association of Dragonistic Fiction Writers) which member's were very creative - there were strict rules about joining - you had to have thought about writing (sci-) fiction yourself. You didn't have to have written something - the people in the association are not some kind of sticklers and creation needs time and practising and stuff. The Shining President (aka Uuk aka The Wild Warrior Tit/Parus) of the association promised everyone white scarves to show how intelligent and creative everyone where and stuff.



We got in. When We were six, We wanted to become a writer.

[papayahed]

This reminds Us the ADFW society (Association of Dragonistic Fiction Writers) which member's were very creative - there were strict rules about joining - you had to have thought about writing (sci-) fiction yourself. You didn't have to have written something - the people in the association are not some kind of sticklers and creation needs time and practising and stuff. The Shining President (aka Uuk aka The Wild Warrior Tit/Parus) of the association promised everyone white scarves to show how intelligent and creative everyone where and stuff.



We got in. When We were six, We wanted to become a writer.


Can I get in if I just thought about it when I read your post?

[OceanSoul]

As long as you promise never to finish it Ocean :p
Er, ah, well....I'll have to think about that one...

[arao]

Yes,In Chinese Edition, it's not so hard to read and even easy.I don't know why.Every hard works in English can be translated in Chinese,and easily to be read for people who graduated from Middle School,some of my friends have read that kind of books enen in Primary School..I have read almost all the classics books in Chinese edition,but only a few in English Edition,they are so hard to read.