George Herbet 'the collar'

[fiona_2104]

Hay im doing an english presentation on George Herbet's 'the collar'. I was wanting to get different opinions and perspectives of the poem. Anyone have any interesting thought or points. Or noticed anything that stood out to them. would be greatful!

[Whifflingpin]

Wot? No replies?

I suppose it is too late now, since students don't usually ask for help 'til the day before.

Why "The Collar" ? reference to a horse's collar, I think, that stops it from careering off on its own path. The last two lines pull the poem/poet up short.

"Shall I still be in suit?" - in debt, that is - to God, I think.

I think it is saying:
1) I deserve credit for something.
2) True, I had everything, until I ruined it.
3) Still I'll make my own way and get everything for myself
4) Oops.

Do you read it that way?

Any more specific questions?

[Il Penseroso]

I think the collar refers to a priest's collar (with a pun on 'choler'). It's about a religious man who comes to question his subservience to God, with the moral being that the man/God relationship is more of a father/son than master/slave, I believe.

What are your thoughts?

[fiona_2104]

I thought of it as the more literal point of the horse collar, which is there to restrict but not harm, Herbet is then applying this principal to the priest collar.
I feel his 'blowing of steam' (if herbet is the subject) hes complaining about the constraints placed on him due to the demand for unquestioning obidience from God. This is going to provoke rebelion, it shows that we all want to resist against constraints, wether it be religious ones or humanist ons, its part of nature.
Also after hes had his rant, I think he realises what a good thing hes got, as he submits to God as soon as he hears him calling, this could be through fear or the realisation that what hes got with God is good, because no master would call a mere servent 'childe'.
What i am struggeling with is

'not so, my heart: but there is friut,
And thou hast hands.
Recover all thy sigh-blown age
On double pleasures: leave thy cold dispute
Of what is fit, and not'

It hasnt clicked with me as well as the rest of the poem has.
Is he refering to his heart having hands?
if he is doesnt the draw attention away from the main point of the poem and to the lines themselves?
I just wasnt sure!
Any thoughts?

[Virgil]

Fiona, next time if it's not too long a poem is easier for people to read and then comment on if you paste into the thread. This is one of my favorite poems. Here it is:


The Collar
George Herbert


I struck the board, and cried, "No more!
I will abroad.
What! shall I ever sigh and pine?
My lines and life are free; free as the road,
Loose as the wind, as large as store.
Shall I be still in suit?
Have I no harvest but a thorn
To let me blood, and not restore
What I have lost with cordial fruit?
Sure there was wine
Before my sighs did dry it; there was corn
Before my tears did drown it.
Is the year only lost to me?
Have I no bays to crown it?
No flowers, no garlands gay? all blasted?
All wasted?
Not so, my heart; but there is fruit,
And thou hast hands.
Recover all thy sigh-blown age
On double pleasures; leave thy cold dispute
Of what is fit and not; forsake thy cage,
Thy rope of sands,
Which petty thoughts have made, and made to thee
Good cable, to enforce and draw,
And be thy law,
While thou didst wink and wouldst not see.
Away! take heed;
I will abroad.
Call in thy death's-head there; tie up thy fears;
He that forbears
To suit and serve his need
Deserves his load."
But as I rav'd, and grew more fierce and wild
At every word,
Me thoughts I heard one calling, "Child";
And I replied, "My Lord."

[Virgil]

That is a good point that the "collar" is punned with his religious collar and with hosre collar. He is blowing off steam, and all it takes is one word by God and he falls right back into place. The theme is his internal desire to be free, "free as the road," contrasted against his obligations to God.