Gothic Horror :]

[LauraJayne]

Hi :]

I'm sorry if this is posted in the wrong place. I'm new and also slightly useless at working out where things are meant to be!

Anyway, the main point of this thread is to gain the opinions of you kind, clever people to help me out :] (That's presuming you don't mind offering your opinions lol!)

I'm about to start my Engliah Language A2 investigation, and I want to use this as a chance to combine English Language with my favourite subject, English Literature. So I plan on doing a comparison between the language use, and features present within the two novels, both of which must belong to the Gothic Horror genre :]

I initially decided upon Bram Stoker's 'Dracula' as my first book for analysis, but now I'm unsure on which other novel I can compare this with.

So, if anyone has ANY suggestions, or just general advice, that would be greatly welcomed!!

Thanks :]

Laura xx

[Schokokeks]

Hi there, Laura, :wave: and welcome to the Forum !

Sounds like an interesting project you've got before you :nod:.
Here are the gothic novels that I know of (since you say that you will be comparing the language, not the content, I will give all the titles that come to my mind):

* The Mysteries of Udolpho by Anne Radcliffe: If I remember correctly, the horror here takes place in a castle in Italy...
* Frankenstein by Mary Shelley, from the Romantic period, quite a well known story and often adapted for the screen.
* The Turn of the Screw by Henry James, which might not be exactly the typical gothic horror, but definetely horror. Since the debates are still going on whether the horror might be of a psychological nature, I can imagine that this would serve very well for a linguistic analysis, since the style very well reflects the atmosphere of the story.

Since I have not read the following two titles yet, I can't comment on them, but maybe you might want to have a look at them, too, before you make your pick:
* The Monk by Matthew G. Lewis
* The Castle of Otranto by Walpole

All of these mentioned are rather classical ones, and in case you might want to include a more modern novel in your pick, have a look at John DeLillo's Underworld. Again, this might not be perfectly gothic, but reminds of me of Dracula concerning the content.

Anyway, let us know which one you picked in the end ! :nod:
Good luck ! :)

[LauraJayne]

Oh, thank you :]

In fact, I was just looking through my Frankenstein notes (I studied Mary Shelley's novel for AS level, and got 85/90 on my paper - maybe it'd be a good idea to look at that considering I seem pretty strong on it :])

But again, thanks for your suggestions!
I'll have a look at all the others anyway, even the one you said isn't typical gothic horror, because my teacher said that it may be a good idea to compare two texts, one of which doesn't comply to the general characteristic of Gothic Horror :D

Oooh, I thought no one would reply, you're ace!

xx

[Schokokeks]

You're very welcome :nod:.

That's great that you've already done some good work on Mary Shelley and can now benefit from it.

Have fun writing ;).

[kathycf]

I was going to suggest The Monk, simply because Dracula and Frankenstein's monster reminds be of a Abbot and Costello movie, although I have to say it was the first choice that popped into my head. :lol:

Anyway, here is the link to a free download of The Monk at Project Gutenberg (http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/601).
Just in case. :)

[LauraJayne]

Thanks Kathycf :]

I'll take a look at it now!

xx

[liesl]

i would definately recommend Frankenstein.

i studied Henry James- Turn of the Screw at A-level for literature compared with Susan Hill - The Woman In Black, both of those texts are full of interesting language from the gothic horror viewpoint. (The Woman in Black i found so scary i found it hard to sleep for a while :( )

either way it sounds like you are writing a very interesting investigation!

[kathycf]

Thanks Kathycf :]

I'll take a look at it now!

xx
Cool, I hope it piques your interest. :)

[ennison]

Here are a few general introductory remarks

What makes a work Gothic is a combination of at least some of these elements:
• a castle, ruined or intact, haunted or not (the castle plays such a key role that it has been called the main character of the Gothic novel),
• ruined buildings which are sinister or which arouse melancholy,
• dungeons, underground passages, crypts, and catacombs which, in modern houses, become spooky basements or attics. They are all tomb-like.
• labyrinths, dark corridors, and winding stairs to suggest the claustrophobic feelings of nightmare.
• shadows, a beam of moonlight in the blackness, a flickering candle, or the only source of light failing (a candle blown out or, today, an electric failure),
• extreme landscapes, like rugged mountains, bleak moors, thick forests, or icy wastes, and extreme weather,
• omens and ancestral curses
• magic, supernatural manifestations, or the suggestion of the supernatural,
• a passion-driven, wilful villain-hero or villain,
• a curious heroine with a tendency to faint and a need to be rescued–frequently,
• a hero whose true identity is revealed by the end of the novel,
• Horrifying (or terrifying) events or the threat of such happenings.
• Overpowering antagonistic forces from within and without face the protagonists. (Alcoholism, addictions, paranoia, depression)
• Wild and ferocious animals
• Wide class differences between the hero and heroine
• Multiple points of view or varied narrative methods help give an air of uncertainty. Which narrator should we trust?


The Gothic creates feelings of gloom, mystery, and suspense and tends to the dramatic and the sensational, like gruesome death, diabolism, violation of purity, and nameless terrors. It crosses boundaries, truth and light versus the dark side, life versus death, consciousness versus unconsciousness, rationality versus irrationality, inhibition versus impulse. Sometimes covertly, sometimes explicitly, it presents transgression, taboos, and fears–fears of violation, of imprisonment, of social chaos, and of emotional collapse. Most of us immediately recognize the Gothic (even if we don't know the name) when we encounter it in novels, poetry, plays, movies, and TV series. For some of us safely experiencing dread or horror is thrilling and enjoyable.
Elements of the Gothic have made their way into mainstream writing. They are found in Sir Walter Scott's novels, Charlotte Bronte’s Jane Eyre , and Emily Bronte’s Wuthering Heights and in Romantic poetry like Samuel Coleridge's "Christabel," and John Keats's "The Eve of St. Agnes." A tendency to the macabre and bizarre which appears in writers like William Faulkner, Truman Capote, and Flannery O'Connor has been called Southern Gothic.

[LauraJayne]

Liesl - thanks :) Sounds very intruiging!

ennison - :D wow. thanks for all of that, you've certainly saved me a lot of time, and definately helped with my analysis. Thank you!! :)

[Alexei]

Wol, all this is very interesting. Actually these could be even some kind of "recipe" how to write a gothic novel.

[LauraJayne]

Wol, all this is very interesting. Actually these could be even some kind of "recipe" how to write a gothic novel.

Indeed they could :D
Pretty mint, that.

[PeterL]

Hi :]


I initially decided upon Bram Stoker's 'Dracula' as my first book for analysis, but now I'm unsure on which other novel I can compare this with.

So, if anyone has ANY suggestions, or just general advice, that would be greatly welcomed!!



You might want to real Post-traumatic Culture: Injury and Interpretation by Kirby Farrell. He looked at horror in popular culture in the late 1800's and the 1980 and '90's as a reaction to changes in socitey. The introduction is on his website: http://www.umass.edu/english/farrell/

[LauraJayne]

Wow!

Sounds great, and kind of similar to part of the investigation that I'm going to have to carry out :D

Thank you:D

xx

[Niamh]

Have you considered maybe the other book being another Bram Stoker? You could do a cross examination of them comparing and contrasting writing styles, content, plot, etc.

The Lady of the Shroud
Lair of the White Worm
The Snakes Pass.

Just a suggestion!;)

[LauraJayne]

Have you considered maybe the other book being another Bram Stoker? You could do a cross examination of them comparing and contrasting writing styles, content, plot, etc.

The Lady of the Shroud
Lair of the White Worm
The Snakes Pass.

Just a suggestion!;)

Well, that's something I really hadn't even considered, yet it makes a lot of sense when you think about it!

I reckon my best chance is to read them all (or as much as I can get through.. even if only the introductory chapters and such) and choose that way.

Thank you :D

[ennison]

Here's a couple of extracts from Gothic horror of the 'Golden Age'

A
“SPARE me, for mercy's sake-for your own sake, spare me—plant not the horrors of unavailing remorse within your bosom-strike not-suspend your uplifted arm—I have another plea to offer-innocence.”
“Innocence,” repeated the count, with a malignant sneer, "then you are better prepared to die. But why do I thus delay my vengeance.”
The count again raised his arm to strike the fatal blow; when a violent knocking suspending his purpose—he flung the dagger into a corner of the room, and stood as if hesitating, whether he should withdraw the bolt from the door. The countess taking advantage of this favourable pause, sprang from her kneeling position, and admitted the intruders, ere her lord was in the least aware of her intention; she staid not to observe who were the persons, whose visit had probably preserved her from a premature death, but rushed along the gallery to her own apartment.
Assisted by Laura, her youthful attendant, Magdalena enveloped her elegant form in a dark mantle, and borrowing from the maiden a close straw bonnet, she left the castle by a back staircase that led to a side door, unobserved by any of the domestics, except Laura, who was her companion in this sudden flight.
About four miles from the Castle of Ottagro stood the ancient Convent of St. Usurla, situated between Ottagro and Campe Marone, in a deep valley. The Lady Viola Serina, the abbess of the sisterhood, was the maternal aunt of the fugitive Magdalena, and here the latter directed her steps, taking her course through obscure and winding paths, as she was apprehensive of pursuit; at length, faint and weary, they reached the gates of the convent, and Laura rang the bell. The portress appeared, and Laura, according to previous instructions from the countess, delivered to her a sealed paper, which the latter had taken from an Indian cabinet a few moments before she left the castle of Ottagro, with a request, that it should be instantly delivered to the abbess.

B
At this moment her father entered the room: She threw herself at his feet in agony. “Father, my dear father! by that tender name I conjure you to hear me! To your commands I have given up the dearest wishes of my heart; I have sworn never to marry the Count without your approbation; do not compel me to be miserable with another; never, never can I love the Baron as a husband; I esteem, I honour him as your preserver; I would lay down my life to prove my gratitude, but I have no heart to give.”
The Count sternly bid her to rise. “I have heard you with patience (said he) and now do you hear me; and not only hear but obey me. You have dared to single out my greatest enemy as the object of your love, and even yet avow your affection for him to my face: I ought not therefore be surprised that this nobleman, who has preserved my life and your honour, should be the object of your aversion! Your conduct sufficiently explains itself, and I know how to set a just value on your love and duty so much boasted of: Now I put it to the proof; this instant I command you to give your hand to the Baron, or my everlasting curses shall follow you to the grave!”
She started up, in a kind of wild horror: “Hold! O hold! Behold your devoted daughter, though distraction and death must be the consequence. Take, take my hand, you may bestow it, but I can never give !”
He snatched her offered hand, and put it into mine; “Receive her, my Lord, receive her, my Lord, as a pledge of gratitude from a father, who dares to boast the gift is worthy of your love; duty and obedience will make her all you can wish for. And you, Eugenia, remember what you owe for me, and for yourself, happiness is in your own power.”
She answered not a word, her tears had ceased to flow, I lifted her hand to my lips, she withdrew it not, but appeared senseless and inanimate, looked alternately at her father and myself, a wildness in her aspect, that seemed unconscious of the objects before her. I tried to recover her from this torpid state by the tenderest expressions: She heard me unmoved, and the Count having called her attendant, advised me to withdraw; I did so, and left them together.


A is from 'The Priory of St Clair' and B is from 'The Cavern of Death'. They both show common features of Gothic style. As an enjoyable exercise for yourself why don't you write something mimicking their style.

Remember that modern writers like Stephen King, Joyce Carol Oates, L P Hartley and many others are strongly influenced by the Gothic. For me personally all that style is a bit of a ludicrous hoot but in the hands of a skilled writer the style breaks free of its sensational origins to rummage successfully in the dark basements of our psychology.

[Niamh]

Well, that's something I really hadn't even considered, yet it makes a lot of sense when you think about it!

I reckon my best chance is to read them all (or as much as I can get through.. even if only the introductory chapters and such) and choose that way.

Thank you :D

The lair of the White worm and the Snakes pass arent as heavy to read as Dracula but both also have origins in the myths and superstions that Stoker grew up with, that are also displayed in Dracula.

[LauraJayne]

Awh Ace :D

Well... it was ace... until one of my English Language teachers asked me to think of something else. I therefore, might be drawing comparisons between Child Language Acquisition, and the way in which Frankenstien's Monster acquires language. One teacher loves the gothic horror idea, one doesnt.

Gah.
What do I do. :(

[Alexei]

This for Frankenshtien's monster sounds really interesting. Still it is a pity they didn't allow you to write on the gothic horror novels, it was a very good topic.

[ennison]

Child language aquisition? That's not an easy or straightforward topic. The Frankenstein's monster text-based part is ok but is your teacher giving you advice on where to find out about children's early language aquisition? Strikes me that taking a 'well-we-all-know-about-that-because-we've-all-been-children' approach might contain hidden pitfalls. Could you spend sime time with pre-school children? If you have very young siblings you have the guinea pigs for observation but if not you and you cant get access to kindergarten kids then you may have to read texts by psychologists and child development experts.

[LauraJayne]

Child language aquisition? That's not an easy or straightforward topic. The Frankenstein's monster text-based part is ok but is your teacher giving you advice on where to find out about children's early language aquisition? Strikes me that taking a 'well-we-all-know-about-that-because-we've-all-been-children' approach might contain hidden pitfalls. Could you spend sime time with pre-school children? If you have very young siblings you have the guinea pigs for observation but if not you and you cant get access to kindergarten kids then you may have to read texts by psychologists and child development experts.


Well, our Unit 1 last year was Child Language Acquisition, so I already know about the theories, and stages etc. Plus, I'm lucky enough to have a 3 year old brother, so I've had first hand experience.

However, she's forgetting the fact that our classes weakest topic is Child Language, as our teacher at the time wasn't really into teaching it :(

I've been able to draw up a few comparisons with the stages and stuff, and I've found stark contrasts with the theories by Skinner and Chomsky.

I just don't know how far I'll get with it.
Still wanting to do Gothic Horror!

xx

[Lioness_Heart]

I think that the gothic horror idea is still really good. If you do Frankenstein, it's so much more than a novel of just one genre that you could have a lot more to explore within that. Could you do something comparing Frankenstein with typical writing of the Romantic movement that Shelley was caught up in? Because it shows quite a lot of the Romantic ideas as well as Gothic. Would you be able to compare Frankenstein with something that Percy Shelley wrote?

[LauraJayne]

I'm totally drawn now.
Absolutely stuck.
My English Teacher who I had for todays lesson still thinks that the Gothic Horror idea is a good one, perhaps if I compare it to a novel which was not considered to be Gothic Horror, but written at the same time.

And she also said to see how much I could find on the Frankenstein and Language Acquisition. But I don't want to end up doing too much work on both when I only need to do one. :(

[Lioness_Heart]

The gothic horror seems to me to be the one where you could have more to write about, and in the way that you want, rather than a more specific title where you have to be really specific before branching out...
But if your're doing Psych. (are you?) then the language one could be a lot easier, because you'd be able to focus in quite quickly.
But anyway... I'm not a teacher, so...

[LauraJayne]

Nah, I'm an English Lang / Lit student (and physics but we dont mention that!) Although we did Child Lang at AS.

Just analysing the first page of Dracula, and comparing it with Tess of the D'Ubervilles (The only novel written at a similar time that wan non-gothic horror that I could find!)

It all started so well.
Now its going awfully!

xx

[Lioness_Heart]

Don't worry about the physics. For AS, I'm doing physics, chemistry, maths, further maths and english lit.

Good luck with your report...
xx

[Alexei]

Yeah, good luck. It is going to be interesting, so don't worry. :)

[ennison]

How did you get on with this?

[Nossa]

I would have recommended Shelley's Frankenstein, but just recently one of my friends recommended 'Turn of The Screw' and I read about it and it sounds really interesting..Maybe you should try and google the names mentioned in this thread...see which one appeals the most to you, and then take it as your second novel!

[Stieg]

Great recommendations...

Robert Louis Stevenson gothic horror stories were highly influential namely Dr. Jeckyll and Mr. Hyde and The Body Snatchers.

How about Sheridan Le Fanu's Carmilla, obviously Bram Stoker cribbed some idears from this story?

Modern gothic horrors how about...

Burnt Offerings by Robert Marasco
The House Next Door by Anne Rivers Siddons
The Legend of Hell House by Robert Matheson
The Haunting of Hill House by Shirley Jackson
The Other by Thomas Tryon

The horror novels of Michael McDowell definitely qualifies as gothic in a more macabre sense.

Katie by Michael McDowell
The Elementals by Michael McDowell

I would not recommend Straub's Ghost Story that is one overrated piece of horror literature. Quite gratuitious and ... b-o-r-i-n-g!

[mtpspur]

Perhaps as a contrast to the gothic, Gaston Leroux's Phantom of the Opera would help seeing the 'gothic' novel evolve thru the years.

[tommyb90]

i am also studying gothic horror as part of my year 12 extension studies course. thought id mention that perhaps if your looking for soemthing not really considered gothic horror, but still with elements of such try The Picture Of Dorian Gray by Oscar Wilde. i also noted that no one had mentioned, An Interview With A Vampire by Anne Rice...perhaps this would be a great comparison of perspectives in gothic horror...but i am also wary that this idea has probably been done to death and may not be what your looking for...

nevertheless good luck

[Alexei]

i am also studying gothic horror as part of my year 12 extension studies course. thought id mention that perhaps if your looking for soemthing not really considered gothic horror, but still with elements of such try The Picture Of Dorian Gray by Oscar Wilde. i also noted that no one had mentioned, An Interview With A Vampire by Anne Rice...perhaps this would be a great comparison of perspectives in gothic horror...but i am also wary that this idea has probably been done to death and may not be what your looking for...

nevertheless good luck

May be could be make a comparison between Interview with a vampire and Dracula in particular. Especially after in the Anne Rice's novel there is actually such a comparison - I mean the journey through Eastern Europe.

[cov]

This is interesting for me because i am also doing Dracula and focusing on the gothic horror elements.
i thought Titus Groan by Mervyn Peake would make an intersting comparison if u wanted to look at the setting and language in particular.
However after reading what everyone here has to say i have gone off the idea.