"Utopias"

[yellowsubmarine]

Literature that regards possible future utopian societies (A Brave New World, 1984) debunks their possibility of coming to being (or at least, the being of one that isn't totalitarian and/or a state of rampant hedonists); is a utopian society truly impossible? I myself can't see them materializing anytime soon, but i would be delighted if i could be convinced otherwise.

[PeterL]

Utopia is no where. Human societies are made up of humans with all that entails, so any human society would include the individual competition, jealousies, greed, lust, etc., etc. that humans have in all of their behaviors. Most of the literature of ideal societies excludes most, or all, of the ordinary characteristics of humans. For evolutionary reasons, I doubt that humans will ever lose greed, competitiveness, etc., but there have been societies that channeled those drives into socially acceptable behavior, and there have been societies that took advantage of those drives on the personal level to aid the society as a whole.

All societies are ideal in the sense that there are the best that is possible in that time and place, but that isn't what you meant to ask. All societies are also the ideal for someone, but you want the one that is ideal for you. Why don't you decide what would be the ideal society for you, then make it happen?

[Nightmare9870]

Utopian societies will never be possible. At least not in the near future. People and governments have tried in the past and all of them have failed. It's human nature to become corrupted and forget about the needs of the people if the leaders have unlimited power and go unchecked. Is it a great idea? You bet. Is it possible? I don't think so. At least not until everyone on the planet puts aside their differences and makes peace. It's hard to have a perfect society when everyone around you hates each other.

Even if they could be created, there will still be problems with making sure that everything is truly done for the benefit of the society. I'm afraid that true utopias will only exist in fiction.

[mono]

To me, yellowsubmarine, your post questions greatly the differences between the ideal and the actual; utopia merely seems an ideal society and community projected.
Replacing the word 'utopia' with 'ideal,' your question may sound more simple, as others have noted, that absolute utopia seems impossible. As horrible as it tends to sound, a ruler (often in a monarchy or oligarchy) may convince himself/herself that he/she can create utopia, but mostly because so few individuals have created the society and community; to others, their followers, etc. this seems far from utopia.
In essence, so long as everyone seems capable of indepedent thought, which hopefully does not disappear anytime soon, everyone will also have a vastly different set of values, beliefs, ideals, desires, etc., making an absolute utopia unfathomable and impossible.

[Kameo]

Big brother is here ? :)

IMHO, utopias don`t show us where we ought to advance, they warn us - don`t make such mistake. Live as good you can. Utopia is possible only in our minds...

[mono]

IMHO, utopias don`t show us where we ought to advance, they warn us - don`t make such mistake.
Hmmm, I have never thought of it this way, but it makes total sense. The ideal utopia would have achieved the highest happiness in a nation; from there, a place would need to advance no further, for a state had then gained achievement.
I suppose this only further demonstrates the impossibility of utopia, due to the incessantly fickle nature of humans, especially in groups, but a very interesting thought you posted, Kameo (welcome to the forum, by the way ;)).

[Kameo]

Right. It`s our nature - to invent various social systems which are inapproachable :brickwall. Its an ancient human game. E.g. Hell and Heaven, total communism or supremacy of a race. Everybody knows that is possible in the abstract but nobody knows how to realize.

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Thanks for invitation. Im pleased ;)

[holograph]

hehe. Who says that this is, in fact, Utopia? A Utopia in it's essence would never exist because the human is imperfect. Put man into a Utopia and he turns it back into the modern hell-hole. I am as far from religious as can be, but take the Adam and Eve fairytale. When you grow a brain, the Utopia dissolves. Furthermore, isn't all of this relative?

[superunknown]

Not all literature concerning utopias is cynical and portrays a terrifying image of a totalitarian government. There's also Plato and Thomas More.