Questions about Islam

[rufioag]

Please, if anyone could answer my question that was posted in the other thread please do so here since the other one was closed. I find it hard to believe that this forum constantly wants people to stay on topic but when you say lets get back on topic, then they say you cant handle a debate.

This is the storyline from the other post I had, Please If you have any understanding of Islam I ask you to clarify. If you have no understanding of Islam and just want to banter go ahead even if its off topic becuase that is allowed but I will defend my position to attempt to keep this thread on topic.

Moon worship has been practiced in Arabia since 2000 BC. The crescent moon is the most common symbol of this pagan moon worship as far back as 2000 BC.
In Mecca, there was a god named Hubal who was Lord of the Kabah.
This Hubal was a moon god.
One Muslim apologist confessed that the idol of moon god Hubal was placed upon the roof of the Kaba about 400 years before Muhammad. This may in fact be the origin of why the crescent moon is on top of every minaret at the Kaba today and the central symbol of Islam atop of every mosque throughout the world: About four hundred years before the birth of Muhammad one Amr bin Lahyo ... a descendant of Qahtan and king of Hijaz, had put an idol called Hubal on the roof of the Kaba. This was one of the chief deities of the Quraish before Islam. (Muhammad The Holy Prophet, Hafiz Ghulam Sarwar (Pakistan), p 18-19, Muslim)
The moon god was also referred to as "al-ilah". This is not a proper name of a single specific god, but a generic reference meaning "the god". Each local pagan Arab tribe would refer to their own local tribal pagan god as "al-ilah".
"al-ilah" was later shortened to Allah before Muhammad began promoting his new religion in 610 AD.
There is evidence that Hubal was referred to as "Allah".
When Muhammad came along, he dropped all references to the name "Hubal" but retained the generic "Allah".
Muhammad retained almost all the pagan rituals of the Arabs at the Kaba and redefined them in monotheistic terms.

I attempt with all sincerity not to disrespect anyones beliefs as is suppose to be done this forum. If a question is disrespectful, then I accept that and will attempt to refute what has been asked. But if a question is an attempt to understand, that is another story and should be looked in upon. Unless it is the attempt of this forum that we should all come in with concieved notions and not be allowed to state them or have them altered if they are untrue.

[paledancer]

I don't know what did you ask, I'didn't catch that but I am ıslam and I can give you an answer as well as I can

[rufioag]

ty, my question is in refrence to that long paragraph. Is it true? I found it on a website and am wondering if the origins of the name Allah are associated to the Moon God that was worshipped before Muhammed. And if so, does this affect the message that Muhammed reported?

[paledancer]

I'm sorry but I've never heard something about this. all I've learnt until today is Koran was told by the Archangel Gabriel day by day to Muhammed to publish the religion (sorry if I've made grammar mistakes)

[rufioag]

No no apologies, I have also never heard of it until today and just thought Id ask, But i did not know that about Islam either, Thank you for the responce on the Issue.

[paledancer]

I really wish I could give you a clear answer, can you tell me the website, I'm wondering too

[rufioag]

That is where I got the story line from.
http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-moon-god.htm

This is another site that claims the same thing.
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/moongod.htm

Now Im not saying that I believe this or not, But these are the sources of the discussion. I am wondering the answer. Maybe the views are slanted becuase both come from sites that are obviously Christian biased which may draw quick conclusions.

[paledancer]

I understand, it's normal that people wonders about religion, I think a lot about it, if there's any questions about islam I can answer, it's better that people asks someone thank you for the adresses

[Shield&Sword]

I saw ur thread about Islam and about the moon thing. I am sorry it was closed.
I just want to say that u must take from authentic resources, and to know religioun, u must read thier books.
We believe that Ismael pbuh son of Abraham pbuh they both built Kaba in mecca, and there was the worship of one God ALLAH, God of Adam Moses Jesus and Muhammed.
Amr Bin Luhay the chief of tribe Khaza'a is the first one who made enter stones to the arabic island, Amr Bin Luhay was an important person, he was rich and helped the poor and was religious, people respected him alot listen to what he say. Once when he was in Sham area (Jordan palastine syria and this area) he saw a nation called in arabic Amaleeq (i dont know in english) praying to stones, he asked them and they said these are our gods, he liked the idea and thoughts its good, coz Sham is the source of prophets and took with him Hubal ( statue) to the Mecca and people accepted what he askedthem and then all Hijaz (arabic island followed Mecca (it was the center of worship).
Hubal was made from red A'qeq ( i think jewels in english) on form of human with a broken hand, so arabs made a golden hand for him, and was the greatest for them, also they took statue called Menah and was for Hatheel and Khuza'a tribes, and Allat in Taef city and was for Thaqeef tribe and Uzzah was for Quraish and Bani kenanah tribes.
And also Amr knew the location of the Noah tribe statues and took thm out and gave them to different tribes:
Statue Wad as for Kalb(tribe near Iraq), Suaa' was for hatheel, Iaghooth was for Bani Ghutaif, Iao'oq was for Hamadan (tribe in Yemen), Khiwan was for Hemiar.And alot of other stones arabs took because of Amr, so the source of Hubal was Sham not arabic Island. The names of statues were names of good persons lived long time ago and people made statues for them and then people after them became to worship them, Wad and Soa' and others perhaps was names of person, Allatt is from the arabic verb Ialott, its an action made (i think mooving the bread in circle form, dont remember well) when some one make the bread, and as i remember they made a statue named such thing from a place where a man ialott the bread. And so on with names.
They began to worship stones to be more close to Allah- Surah 39 verse 3 "Is it not to Allah that sincere devotion is due? But those who take for protectors others than Allah (say): "We only serve them in order that they may bring us nearer to Allah." Truly Allah will judge between them in that wherein they differ. But Allah guides not such as are false and ungrateful."
Allah always existed as name for God, and 2000 b.c people worshipped Allah (the only one God, God of Abraham pbuh) this worship remained untle Amr came and made his black act.
Arabs who worshipped stones were called Moshrek, its an arabic word that mean made a partner, because they believed in Allah but they made partners for him, see the verse above.
"If indeed thou ask them who has created the heavens and the earth and subjected the sun and the moon (to His Law), they will certainly reply, "Allah." How are they then deluded away (from the truth)?" Surah 29 verse 61, they admit Allah created things but they made partners for him.
Muhammed when he entered Meccah after his religioun was spread, he went to Kaba and found alot of statues inside Kaba, and there was a statue on form of Abraham and was Iastaqsem Bilazlam (a type of lottery), and prophet pbuh said words which mean Abraham wasnt making such thing and destroyed all statues. As u see arabs knew Abraham and Ismael, but they lost the path so Allah sent his last massenger pbuh to complete the whole massege.
About worshiping moon u will find these things only in sites even i see they are christian sites no wonder what they wrote, my advice is to read Holy Quran and Books of Sunnah (sayings of Prophet pbuh), the authenticated sayings.
Reading Muhammed pbuh teaching and the Holy Quran u will find the pure monothism, no pagan no statues, u read and judge.
About the name Allah get in this site (christian site) and u will find the different words in aramic (language of Jesus pbuh) and listen to how they pronounce the name Allah which mean GOD even in aramic it existed, and will hear the name of Jesus in arabic in islam which is Esah and close to Esho, while arabic christians say his name is Iasoo' (they put the first letter in the last).
http://www.learnassyrian.com/aramaic/church/church.html

[SheykAbdullah]

Originally I posted something that was exactly like what Xamonas said in the previous thread, which would be the objective hoistorical/anthropological answer. Since it doesn't seem that that approach worked in the last thread to avoid any conflict I am deleting my post.

[Logos]

My closure of your other topic had nothing to do with "staying on topic", I thought you wanted it closed because you wrote "how about we just close this thread" but I see that what you wrote is not what you meant at all.

Carry on.

[miss tenderness]

thanks logos for the hard work u do

rufio it is good that u ask rather than just adopting the idea and the websites that u stated are not even close to Truth.

sheild an sword 's answer is quite the truth and if u have anyother wonders we r waiting:)

[Xamonas Chegwe]

I still maintain that this thread (and its predecessor) is nothing more than an effort to antagonise those of a different faith and belittle their beliefs by means of a spurious argument. I feel the same about the many threads posted by muslims that aim to 'prove' that Jesus is merely a prophet and not an aspect of God (it should come as no surprise to learn that I subscribe to neither of the above :D).

By all means discuss the religious literature - as that is the stated purpose of this forum - but please, please, please keep your evangelism, prosyletising, crusades and holy wars to yourselves.

And that goes to Hindus, Buddhists, Jains and Ba'hais too! Just in case you were thinking of joining the melée!

[Mililalil XXIV]

Putting into this thread nothing more than a simple literary approach, might we not see how the names of different gods compare, and compare different etymologies? Some see "`Allah" as parallel to "`Al-Illah". But is this accurate? An Arabic expert might want to show the proof of this assertion that "`Allah" is from "`Al-Illah", and, therefore, a form of "`Eloah". Without perfect evidence, one has a right to wonder if an alternative might not be the only true explanation. Seeing as there was the term "Ra" used by some in Egypt as denoting whom they thought to be the supreme Deity, and since it is not certain in some cases whether a hieroglyph transliterated [R] shouldn't rather be transliterated [L], can you see my point? Is "`Allah" a specific sort of name? Is "Ra" a general word applied in a special manner? On the other hand, there is a Dravidian phonetic I have heard which sounde to me like something between a [Y] and an [R]. Since some make a comparison of the "Aton" of ancient Egypt to Hebrew "ADONAY", a Divine Title in Scripture, could "Ra" once have been pronounced "YAH"? We have all probably read of "Aten-Ra" from Egyptological articles. In like word order, there is named in Hebrew Scripture "ADONAY YHWH". See how many different ways one can make things to show superficial connection? "YAH" has no lexical relation to "`ELOAH", though both can be applied to YHWH `ELOHIM. What do you think?

[rufioag]

How do Muslims get to wherever they go afterdeath? Sorry I do not know the name.

[Nightshade]

How do Muslims get to wherever they go afterdeath? Sorry I do not know the name.
Heaven and hell same as in christianity and we get there via the day of judgement same as christians :D

[Shield&Sword]

I hope you read this all.
Urah 67 verse 2 ""He Who created Death and Life, that He may try which of you is best in deed; and He is the Exalted in Might, Oft-Forgiving;""
The one who watch deeply in this life know that this world this life this universe is bigger than to be existed only to eat and sleep and then vanish, know that its bigger than to be formed from nothing, or all came by chance, begining from atom to universe all work according rules, nothing can go out. Who made thses rules? who is the wise one who made all this? who is the one who hold the sun far from earth, that gave the moon his orbit, that designed all in this incredible thing?
Every one think of this power that made all this, feel this power.
God the almighty created all for purpose, he gave us minds to think and choose, the one who remember God and admit his existence God will remember him. The who say i am what i am because of me only, the one who forget God, God will forget him in other life, will give him what he deserve.
The common thing between all humanity is to believe or not to believe, life is not getting more knowledge not all humans have same minds, life is not making mony some is poor and some is rich, life is not getting married some can and some could not, life is not drinking and eating some have to eat some have nothing to eat. The only thing that every one have is mind, the common thing between all minds is to know God and to accept him or not, the poor the rich the intellegent the less intellegent the beutifull the less beutifull, the thing that every one have is mind to choose God or to refuse him.
God say to us why he created us: Surah 51 verse 56 "have only created Jinns and men, that they may serve Me."
Does God need us? God doesnt need any one, every man and woman on earth work for him self and her self, and in the last day every one will get according to what he gave in life.
Paradise s the what God prepaired for people who believe in him and think of him and follow his prophets and work as he ordered us. The same paradise that Noah and Abraham and Isac and Ismael and Solmon and david and Moses and Jesus and all prophets peace be upon them and all prophets talked about.
Surah 2 verse 136 "" Say ye: "We believe in Allah, and the revelation given to us, and to Ibrahim, Isma'il, Ishaq, Ya'qub, and the Tribes, and that given to Musa and 'Isa, and that given to (all) Prophets from their Lord: we make no difference between one and another of them: and we bow to Allah (in Islam).""
Surah 3 verse 84 ""Say: "We believe in Allah, and in what has been revealed to us and what was revealed to Ibrahim, Isma'il, Ishaq, Ya'qub, and the Tribes, and in (the Books) given to Musa, 'Isa, and the Prophets, from their Lord: we make no distinction between one and another among them, and to Allah do we bow our will (in Islam).""
God told us by his prophets how to get to the paradise (Sura 2 " 37Then learnt Adam from his Lord words of inspiration, and his Lord turned towards him; for He is Oft-Returning, Most Merciful. 38 We said: "Get ye down all from here: and if, as is sure, there comes to you guidance from Me, whosoever follows My guidance, on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve. [39] "But those who reject Faith and belie Our Signs, they shall be Companions of the Fire; they shall abide therein." ).
Making good deeds is the massage of all prophets:
Surah 10 verse 9 "Those who believe, and work righteousness, their Lord will guide them because of their Faith: beneath them will flow rivers in Gardens of Bliss."
Sura 11 verse 23 "But those who believe and work righteousness, and humble themselves before their Lord, they will be Companions of the Garden, to dwell therein for aye!"
Sura 13 verse 29 "For those who believe and work righteousness, is (every) blessedness, and a beautiful place of (final) return."
Sura 14 verse 23 "But those who believe and work righteousness will be admitted to Gardens beneath which rivers flow, to dwell therein for aye with the leave of their Lord. Their greeting therein will be: "Peace!" "
Sura 17 verse 9 "Verily this Qur-an doth guide to that which is most right (or stable), and giveth the glad tidings to the Believers who work deeds of righteousness, that they shall have a magnificent reward;"
Sura 18 verse 46 "Wealth and sons are allurements of the life of this world; but the things that endure, Good Deeds, are best in the sight of thy Lord, as rewards, and best as (the foundation for) hopes."
Surah 18 "106] That is their reward, Hell; because they rejected Faith, and took My Signs and My Messengers by way of jest. [107] As to those who believe and work righteous deeds, they have, for their entertainment, the Gardens of Paradise, "
Surah 7 verse 42 "But those who believe and work righteousness - no burden do We place on any soul, but that which it can bear - they will be Companions of the Garden, therein to dwell (for ever)."
Sura 4 verse 124 "If any do deeds of righteousness, - be they male or female - and have faith, they will enter Heaven, and not the least injustice will be done to them."
Surah 16 verse 97 "Whoever works righteousness, man or woman, and has Faith, verily, to him will We give a new Life, a life that is good and pure, and We will bestow on such their reward according to the best of their actions."

Acting right in this life will make life better, its the nature of human to seekf for God to like good deeds, God gave every one mind that can choose and can know. God is so mercifull, he sent to us his prophet and he showed us the right path, He told us what to do and what not to do, and making as God ordered us mean to follow him and in every thing he ordered us to do will make our bodys and souls clean and pure, earth is only a period of exam not eating and drinking (surah 2 verse 36 "Then did Satan make them slip from the (Garden), and get them out of the state (of felicity) in which they had been. We said: "Get ye down, all (ye people), with enmity between yourselves. On earth will be your dwelling place and your means of livelihood for a time.")
The who mistake God will forgive him if he repent and return to the right path (Sura 39 verse 53 "Say: "O my Servants who have transgressed against their souls! despair not of the Mercy of Allah: for Allah forgives all sins: for He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.")
Saying God has son or he has wife or mother or partners is is like not believeing in God, because melieving in God mean believing no one equal to him, he is the almighty, the most beutiful, UNIQUE there is nothing like him in shape and power and acts, he is the absolute in his charcters and names.
Surah 4 verse 48 "Allah forgiveth not that partners should be set up with Him; but He forgiveth anything else, to whom He pleaseth; to set up partners with Allah is to devise a sin most heinous indeed."
Surah 4 verse 116 "Allah forgiveth not (the sin of) joining other gods with Him; but He forgiveth whom He pleaseth other sins than this: one who joins other gods with Allah, hath strayed far, far away (from the Right)."

This is the massage of Jesus pbuh like all the massages of all prophet beginning from Adam finishing with Muhammed peace upon them all.
Surah 5 verse 72 "They do blaspheme who say: "Allah is Al-Masih the son of Maryam." But said Al-Masih: "O Children of Israel! Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with Allah, Allah will forbid him the Garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrong-doers be no one to help."
Surah 9 verse 31 "They take their priests and their anchorites to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Al-Masih, the son of Maryam; yet they were commanded to worship but One God: there is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him)."
Surah 19 ""[88] They say: "(Allah) Most Gracious has begotten a son!" [89Indeed ye have put forth a thing most monstrous! [90] As if the skies are ready to burst, the earth to split asunder, and the mountains to fall down in utter ruin. [91] That they should invoke a son for (Allah) Most Gracious. [92] For it is not consonant with the majesty of (Allah) Most Gracious that He should beget a son. [93] Not one of the beings in the heavens and the earth but must come to (Allah) Most Gracious as a servant. [94] He does take an account of them (all), and hath numbered them (all) exactly. [95] And every one of them will come to Him singly on the Day of Judgment. [96] On those who believe and work deeds of righteousness will (Allah) Most Gracious bestow Love.""

[Shield&Sword]

Surah 4 verse 157 ""That they said (in boast), "We killed Al-Masih 'Isa the son of Maryam, the Messenger of Allah"; but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not.""
Surah 4 verse 171 ""O People of the Book! commit no excesses in your religion: nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Al-Masih 'Isa the son of Maryam was (no more than) A Messenger of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Maryam, and a Spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His Messengers. Say not "Trinity": desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is One God: glory be to Him: (far Exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs.""
Surah 5 verse 116 ""And behold! Allah will say: "O 'Isa the son of Maryam! didst thou say unto men, 'Worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of Allah'?" He will say: "Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, Thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart, though I know not what is in Thine. For Thou knowest in full all that is hidden. ""

And finally:
Surah 2 verse 79 ""Then woe to those who write the Book with their own hands, and then say: "This is from Allah," to traffic with it for a miserable price! Woe to them for what their hands do write, and for the gain they make thereby. ""

[Shield&Sword]

This post here is to respond the claims of Rufioag in this thread
http://www.online-literature.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17273&page=5

The verse that the user posted cutting it from the context trying to change the main idea.
He asked this question: Who are these daughters of Allah? are they Goddesses? And then he posted the verse 53:19-20. If he continued the 3 verses after he will find the answer of his question but....
Surah 53 verse 21 What! for you the male sex, and for Him, the female? 22 Behold, such would be indeed a division most unfair! These are nothing but names which ye have devised, - ye and your fathers - for which Allah has sent down no authority (whatever). They follow nothing but conjecture and what their own souls desire! Even though there has already come to them Guidance from their Lord!

As you see no such question cant be asked if any one continue the verses.
Prophet Muhammed peace be upon him sent Ali Bin Abi Taleb to destory the statue Minat. He pbuh sent Almoghera Bin Sho'ba and ABo Sofian Bin Harb to destroy Allat statue. He pbuh sent Khaled Bin Alwaleed to destory Al Uzza statue.
The story of Ubai proove that that Arabs prayed to one god begore which is Allah, God of ABraham and Moses and Jesus and all prophets peace be upon them all. After Ubai made arabs worship statues with Allah, Allah t sent his prophet Muhammed peace be upon him and destroyed all and showed the right path.

About gathering Holy Quran in one book:
The first one who gathered Holy Quran in one book was the first calipha Abo Bakr, so i dont know how the user said this phrase: The Koran was revealed to Muhammad and he transmitted it to his following who compiled it during the decades after his death.
Abo Bakr was calipha for 2 years only after prophet pbuh and he ordered companions to compile Holy Quran in one book and he preserved it, then calipha Omar preserved it and then Hafsa Hafsa (wife of prophet peace be upon him, and doughter of second calipha Omar), and book was called for that Moshaf Hafsa (Quran of Hafsa). I dont know if in english decades are only 2 YEARS.
But i see he mixed things up, because he think that Uthman is the one who compiled Holy Quran. The user said: each using different material based on the recitations of different caliphs.
If Uthman is the third Calipha and was nearlly 13 years afters prophet peace be upon him, and there were only 2 calipha before him and only one who compiled Holy Quran so how it will exist different recitations of caliphs?

Holy Quran was sent in arabic in 7 recitation (qira'at). Different tribes were using arabic language but there are words that a tribe use,that another tribe use another word instead. The Holy Quran was sent in this way to make it easy on different tribes to understand the massage. The matter is that tribes continued to use the deffernt recitations. At time of 3rd calipha Uthman he decided to COPY HOLY QURAN, and he decided to copy them using the QURAISH tongue (tribe of prophet Muhammed pbuh, and was the right tongue), becuase its the original language of Holy Quran and other reciations were to make it easy on people. He brought Mashaf Hafsa and gahtered companions and ordered them to make copies, they made 4 copies and sent a copy to the different areas in islamic world and he preserved a copy to him self, and his copy exist unlte these days in Turkey. When companions finished from writing Quran he looked at them and at Mushaf Hafsa and found no difference. What we have now is the Holy Quran in tongue of Quraish and prophet Muhammed peace be upon him, the tongue in which Holy Quran was sent.
Another thing i must say that Holy Quran wasnt preserved on papers only. It was preserved in Memory of people (there are nearlly 9 million people in islamic world now who put all holy quran in memory, word by word, and some of them know the chain of people who transfered Holy Quran from prophet untle nowadays name by name). It was preserved also in everyday life, people used return always to holy quran to take laws, lessons, worship Allah.
Holy Quran was never behind back of people, if you say a verse infront someone it wont be like he hear it for first time like other religioun does.
You asked who cllected Holy Quran? if you would like i can write names of companions and thier family and tribes. All your claims showed sorry for this, but that you dont know any thing about collecting Holy Quran, all you did is entering site which paste claims WITHOUT PROOF. You wont see them say these things in public infront muslims scholars, only hiding in sites. Next time bring your proof please, book name and page (trusted books, not books of non muslims).

About asking forgivness: the user posted a verse and tried to show that even Muhammed is full of sins. Would like to say something: if your religioun teach you you are sinfull and was born full of sins without any harm you did, and that God couldnt forgive you, and that people is bad, please dont misure it on others.
We believe every one is born without any sin, clean. Allah forgive all sins, and no one take sins of his father because God is justice, and he is mercifull, he love us, and created us and honered us. The person begin to commit sins after he become adult when he start to do bad things, but if he return to Allah and ask forgivness from a clean honest heart, then Allah will forgive him, he is MERCIFULL.
About the verse 47:19.
You dont know the method of Holy Quran. In alot of verses Allah talk to his prophet using YOU but the talk is to all islamic nation. This verse teach us to ask forgivness for our selves and for our brothers and sisters in islam. Beside prophet Muhammed peace be upon him is our example in life and we try to behave like him because he was on right path and he did right things that make us reach paradise, when Allah said to him ask forgivness, it was so the islamic nation follow him and say like him. you can go back to Al Qurtuby book in explaining the Holy Quran and you will see this matter.
Not only Muhammed peace be upon him asked forgivness, but also another prophets did, and we dont say they are sinfull, we take them as example and we say as they said, Allah gave us prophets words about how we ask Allah things, and how we ask forgivness, not storys of adultery or incest and drunk prophets who they are innocent from such things.

Would like to hear an answer about canceled added verses i posted about bible and that its not matter of translations only.
ABout Holy Quran you said there are contraddictions but i saw you didnt brought added canceled verses or contraddictions between verses, or different copies, like american copy or african or asian copies with deffernce of chapters.

[rufioag]

I appreciate the answers Shield and Sword, You would like me to research so I look up things on the Koran and then ask you, since you seem to know quiet a bit about that as well. But I would say that you should listen to your own arguement about bring arguements from Non Christians who have something against our religion. I would like you to post references and books plus author of where you get your arguements. Maybe we will actually get somewhere in our discussion. But do not claim that I am the only one that does it becuase many of your arguements come from your own personal bias and do nothing to help your claim because its like the sunrise, Ive seen em all before.

I will get back to you on these "Canceled" verses in a deeper discussion. But like I said, the bible is over 99.5% accurate with the manuscripts with NO, NONE, ZERO, amount of the innacuracies that have significant docturinal changes and alsmost all are attributed to misspellings due to scribes.

[Shield&Sword]

Rufioag all my claims were from bible. if you look at my claims, or i paste verses from bible with number and version, or a christian site when i want to give an example or i ask aquestions i didnt go out from these thing. Didnt write things from history books and what they say about historical events that you find in bible or any external book, or any other thing.

[rufioag]

But when we reply you do not listen.

[Mariam]

Great work Shield&Sword..

rufioag, why don't you try reading som book written by muslims on this matter.I recieved a PM from another forum dealing with the same issue, I know i may not be as good as Shield&Sword talking about Islam, but one simple thing I know is that those idol were to make the people get closer to the one and only God and that was from the days of prophet Ibraham, and these things passed on to arabs as Ibraham and Ismaeel (puot) built the ka'ba in Mecca which is an arabic place.The first Arab to introduce idol worship was `Amr ibn Luhayy who changed the religion of Ibrahim and people went back to worshiping idols as i said before to draw nearer to Allah or God, and Prophet Muhammed was sent to purify the worship for ALLAH alone.


Shield&Sword, nice avatar are you living there?

[Shield&Sword]

Rufioag, you posted the moon things and doughters of Allah and compilation of Holy Quran with no evidence, if you go back to my posts about catholic and protestant and orthodox bibles, and verses you will see i wrote numbers and differences, i didnt talk about history of bible or any thing out of bible, talked only about Bible verses and you can check out all my previuos posts.

Thx Mariam. No i dont live there, its Mecca, wish to go one day (and must go). Insha ALLAH.
Also you Mariam must learn islam more and more, will be good for this life and other life.

[Mariam]

Thx Mariam. No i dont live there, its Mecca, wish to go one day (and must go). Insha ALLAH.
Also you Mariam must learn islam more and more, will be good for this life and other life.

I dont want to take this thread out of its topic, but I realy need some help in that, no one reachs out to help!

[rufioag]

Why do u have to go to a physical city? Also, I have given you answers on many of your topics but I have finally reliezed something. That no matter what evidence I site nor the attempt to clarify a subject, it does not matter because you do not believe the Bible is accurate anyways.


I do not attempt to argue the Koran becuase I do not know it, my statements were to see if what other people said were accurate because I do not know.

http://www.muslimhope.com/DaughtersOfAllah.htm

That is where I found some of the verses, you can check up on it if you like. Once again, I do not attempt to argue against Islam through the Koran becuase i do not have any knowledge of the book. I simply brought arguements of others.

[Shield&Sword]

About going to a phisiscal city will explain later, but its obvious if you watch T.V and see this city that its great, no one with a big golden ring and with so expensive clothes and then claim to be so poor and highest scholar, no black musques and white musques as churchs in west untlethese days. All equal infront Allah, all muslims must know this thing. But i dont have time now to go further, little bit busy these days.

Rufioag never saw such a research ,no evidence, no proof, only a pathetic way to explain things they dont understand.

(verses 53:21-22 today)
What they mean by today. The holy Quran of Othman exist untle these days and its the same book exist in hands of all muslims.

Beside they said that verses were added but without any proof, any one can say this verse was added or canceled, but we are nation of proof, bring proof and we will be happy to discuss it. Without proof it will remain baby talk. Notice that when they explain Verses of Holy Quran they dont bring proofs, no authentic book, they only talk and talk, and even a stupid can talk. Verses i posted about bible i showed you how they were canceled, and even about trinity others said that canceling the verse doesnt cancel trinity. And you can check other canceled verses. Proof.

when they explained these verses they didnt go to the verse after which explain what are these names. The verse is 53:23 "These are nothing but names which ye have devised, - ye and your fathers - for which Allah has sent down no authority (whatever). They follow nothing but conjecture and what their own souls desire! Even though there has already come to them Guidance from their Lord!".
In site you pasted they cut verses and explain in so pathetic way. Even you once talked about cutting and pasting and claimed that i do such thing.
If you read my post above you will see that Muhammed peace be upon him destroyed these statues, and there is no existence to them. When Muhammed peace be upon him entered Mecca he destoyed all statues, and history witness on that.

Second thing, Sayings said in history books (hadeeth) some of them true and some of them is wrong. The writers of history werent hadeeth researchers, so they put what they find and the hadeeth scholars decide acording knowing the person who narraited is lier or not, one who forget or not. So every hadeeth exist in history must be checked in books of hadeeth scholars, if they are accepted or not, because historical writers write all what they get and they use words before hadeeth if they are sure about this hadeeth or not. So the one who wrote that page on net tried again in so pathetic way to approove his opinion thinking people is ignorant.


Will show what scholars said in other paste and the problems of story, will be long a little bit, but must translate first.

[Logos]

I wonder if some of you can ever accept the fact that you have different opinions and interpretations, and you're not going to change each other's opinions and interpretations.

Please avoid excessive copying and pasting.

[RJbibliophil]

Shield&Sword, just because I am as curious as a cat, could you give a brief overview of what you believe about Jesus? Who you believe he was and why. Something short, brief, and to the point, without long koran passages and refuting what others believe.

[Shield&Sword]

The matter is that alot of lies are said about Holy Quran and islam, as in site Rufioag put. They cut stories from context and cut chain of narraiters, and they think if they mention arabic names then its true. This thread is named Question about islam, and with knowledge Allah gave me will try as i could to clear things here,beside i learn alot of new things, i am not trying to change any one opinion, every one is responsible of him self.

About Jesus peace be upon him: i believe he is a great prophet not God or son of God and was born in a mircale made by Allah, if Allah say to thing be and it is. He wasnt crucified and didnt die yet Allah raised him to sky and will return, Allah gave him the Vangel at his life. His mother was pregnant withuot relation with man, she is one of greatest women on earth, pure, honest. And no moslim is a muslim if he refuse Jesus peace be upon him, he is like Moses and Muhammed and all other pure prophets.
This is what we believe about Jesus pbuh.

[myself]

hi everyone. i was reading all of this to no wut u wer talkin about, i will answer the Q about jesus. i think this was the thing that separated muslims and christians. as muslims we believe that thier is one god and no other. christians believe jesus is the son of god, which is y they dont believe in prophet muhammed (PBUH). in our quran it is said that jesus told his ppl that there will be abother propet after him but becuase the bible was changed, generation after generation ppl did not beleive a prophet was coming and thought it was that jesus told the future and so worsipped him!!!!

i hope this answered the Q along with the answer of shield and sword!!!!!!

[Shield&Sword]

Now lets see the site of rufioag:
There is no evidence that scholars said its right story, and in the site, the one who claim didnt say muslims believe in this story or scholars said its true, all he did was putting the story and saying NAMES OF SCHOLARS WHO MENTIONED IT in thier books, without further info, and subject is written without pages and without chain of narraiters (because if he mentione names it will be against him). Only chain of Ibn ishaq, and he wrote it in so dirty way thinking people is ignorant, putting ---> between names.

Ibn Katheer said : its not narraited about prophet Muhammed peace be upon him with true chain on narraiters. (or it contain liers or its broken or there are names not mentioned).
I wrote the ways that trasmitt it,they are 10, and wrote the problem in every chain said by the biggest scholars of islam. If Rufioag want that i paste these chains i will but will so big paste, and there are name and words that scholars use that wont serve users here so it will be big, but i am ready.

Ibn Khozaima said: this story is putten by disbelievers (liers who claim to be muslims).
Ibn Hazm said: clear lie and its not true by chain or by the words of it. and every one can say lies.
Albaihaqy said this story is not true by chain. and the story in Bukhary (one of hadeeths books) is without the of talking good about stones.
These are from biggest scholars.

The stories mentioned also by different chains contraddict between each other.

If you want the explination in long paste will do it, just tell me.

The book of Salman Rushdie about islam, he wrote it to go to the west. He talked also bad about U.K and west, but when west saw the lies he wrote about islam they were so happy and took him to west, and people of west doesnt know what he was saying really about them, he played on both sides. But what to do. Ahmed Deedat gave a lecture in UK about this matter, and he offered money to a channel to let him show what he really did, but western channel didnt accept. Will try to find the lecture and paste a link to it.

About the objections of Muslims mentioned in the site, i think that the writer was inventing objections, as expected no names of scholars, no names of book which object nothing. And Muslims dont object with some of objections written they are stupid objections, this story doesnt exist in world of true, and this thing was showed by scholars.

Want only ONE verse from Holy Quran and from authentic hadeeths of prophets that we accept that show we pray to stones or we talk good about stone. Only one.

I say to the writer what Jesus pbuh said in Luke 6:42 "Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother’s eye."
What bible say about prophets? David: ch1 21:1 And Satan stood up against Israel, and provoked David to number Israel.
Prophet David is provoked by Satan, the interesting thing is that this verse cant be denied, and psalms o David is used alot as prophecis about new test. Could the devil provoke David to write his pslams?
Solmon: 1Ki 11:4 "For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the LORD his God, as was the heart of David his father."
1Ki 11:5 "For Solomon went after Ashtoreth the goddess of the Zidonians, and after Milcom the abomination of the Ammonites."

Solmon followed other god, even godess, what about his song and the sayings that they refair to Jesus pbuh.
Why they dont look what they have in thier book, they come in pathetic way and say lies and invent stories.

The writer then say "Dont follow a mortal man". He invite us to follow a mortal god!!!
Men are men, who follow God will win who refuse will lose, there is nothing about following died man and these strnage words.

I mentioned above what scholars said about this story, but if you want more i can paste. Hope you read all.
For arabic readers you can return to the study made by shiekh Alalbany named: نصب المجانيق لنسف قصة الغرانيق In which he show the matter and what scholars said, and problems of this story.

[Logos]

Ahmed Deedat gave a lecture in UK about this matter, and he offered money to a channel to let him show what he really did, but western channel didnt accept. Will try to find the lecture and paste a link to it.


Please don't, it will just get deleted.

"These forums are not here for preaching, or attempts to convert, nor promote other religiously affiliated websites."

And please remember, "you cannot copy and paste huge tracts of text, you shouldn't need more than a few sentences, or maybe one paragraph to make your point in reference to the discussion."

"Admin and the Moderators reserve the right to edit, delete, close, and/or remove topics or posts, not always with warning. It is up to you to understand the forum rules."

[Shield&Sword]

it ok. But only wanted to say its not preaching,it doesnt talk about religiuon. Its a lecture on how Rushdie worked on both sides. Wont paste any link.

[RJbibliophil]

Allah gave him the Vangel at his life. What is it you mean by Vangel?

Do you believe that Jesus only seemed to be crucified and died, but didn't, or that He never was crucified at all, that He just rose to heaven?

BTW, you were very nice, kind and clear in your explanation. :D

[Shield&Sword]

Sorry i thought the word vangel is used also in english, i meant gospel.

About crucifiction its interested no?
I saw book of Judah in a library, when i will have money i will buy it if Allah wants, its so interesting book. Because Judah died in bible in 2 ways, once he hanged him self and once he fell down and his stomic went out.
Even from bible we see that crucifiction stories in 4 gospels are not identical. The most interesting thing is that prophecy of Jesus pbuh didnt work, he said he will remain in grave for 3 days and 3 nights SAME AS JONAH REMAINED IN FISH, COMPLETE 3 DAYS AND 3 NIGHTS. Did Jesus pbuh remained in grave same thing?

Didnt read yet alot about this argument, and lets try not to change the argument here because i think Logos is already angry with me for changing subjects of threads.

B.T.W you were more nice and kind that you didnt say you speak english better than people which english is not thier mother language.

Only to be clear. We believe that not Jesus pbuh who was crucified but another person who Allah made him like Jesus pbuh, and people thought he is Jesus pbuh. Jesus pbuh was saved and raised to Allah.

[James Wallace]

There is a refutation that I consider to be good to the matter of the Muslims claimed to worship the moon at the thread "The myth of the Moon God" in the religious texts forum.

See this:
http://www.online-literature.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22298

[HUDA]

Dear Rufioag,

I found your first question (about Hubal...) very intersting, and I would like to admit that I never heard about what was mentioned there about worshipping the moon.
The (Kora'an) (Muslims holy book) mentions more than once that the moon and the son are created by ALLAH and one should never worship any but ALLAH. It is very clearly written in (Kora'an), so personally I don't have any doubt about that.
Concerning the Crescent sign, well in early Islam they didn't use any sign to recognise them, it was even forbidden to do so, the use of crescent started by the (Ottman Empire) and it went like a trend since then.
I hope that may make some points clear for you somehow.
Regards...

[Poetess]

Lets not suggest reading any Islamic book knowing that not all of Muslims are the same.
The thought of Allah is definitely common; however, some of them are tooooo strict, and others make things as simple as they can.
The most recommended way - suggested by me - is to read the Qura`an itself, the book of Allah`s words.

[Nightshade]

.
The most recommended way - suggested by me - is to read the Qura`an itself, the book of Allah`s words.

Got to agree to a point with that but if you are going to do that make sure you get a decent translation one where the transaltor first languge is at least one of the languges thats written in. And dont go for the really old ones, or for than matter the penguin version they do somthing odd where by they reversed the numbers. so they came at the befining instead of the end. And I know thats only somthing small but if they changed that much who knows what else they messed with?

[unknown_lady]

hi bro

you'r topic is wonderful and i will be glad to tach you some information about my religion

No allah is not Hubbal the God of moon as you mention

'Allah' was there before hubal and everything he is th one who creat the world
the eart,heaven and hell before he started to invent people

my bro if you'r a jewish or christian so you will with no doubt understand what i say

we and jewish and christian havethe same God 'allah ' the only one the creater

all humanbeing are the sons of Adams and Eve

we Muslim do believe in all the prophet and some of jewi=sh and christian believes . Because the other that we don't believe in is what the normal human wrote by their hands and not from 'Allah' .

what make us different from jewish is alot of things
but christian maybe more closer to us before not now i guess

cause christian were not allowed to be usury like us and not like jewish but alot of things changed in christainty

anyway

other thing that make us alil different is that they consider Jesus as A god
but we consider it as aprophet



anyway you also asked about where they go after death right we go either to heel or heaven according to the things you done in the world

[littlewing53]

i am curious of this teaching...does the koran teach muslims must kill all infidels (people do not follow the koran) then muslims go to heaven, seventy rooms, seventy virgins...is this part of the muslin teachings...or a lie?

[unknown_lady]

Hi little wing..

No it's alie

our religion Islam never said to kill people even if they don't fellow your religion

No ...our religion never said such it's ahuge lie

i mean you know as we all know that there are some people who like to lie about religion ND THIS IS ONE OF THEIR LIE

don't you know that our religion prevent us to kill anyone except if he kill someone so we do the same to him ...<<< This is something unversal even the countries whicj did't believes in God or such do the same in judge court Righ

and when a muslimkill someone who his country never hurts islam should pay a money to his family

In our religin kill people our even you'r self is prevented

cause God told us that the soul is something precious we should kept it




But unfotunantialy some people misunderstood this and kill whatever and whenever they saw a man from different religion

[unknown_lady]

hi all this is a good site may teel you about every thing you want to know about Islam
http://english.islamway.com/

and i will be dlad to teel you more and more

[miss tenderness]

http://discover.islamway.com/articles.php?article_id=47&lang=1

a direct link to littlewing's question:)

[billyjack]

good book about islam called "islam" by huston smith. its short, maybe 90 pages. smith is a master of world religions and gives a view of islam that involves the good along with the bad.

and about islam. the koran get misinterpeted. so does the bible, so does the torrah, the toa te ching, ect...

[shadowy girl]

Please, if anyone could answer my question that was posted in the other thread please do so here since the other one was closed. I find it hard to believe that this forum constantly wants people to stay on topic but when you say lets get back on topic, then they say you cant handle a debate
.
i'm a moslim , so I'll answer


.[/QUOTE]
This is the storyline from the other post I had, Please If you have any understanding of Islam I ask you to clarify. If you have no understanding of Islam and just want to banter go ahead even if its off topic becuase that is allowed but I will defend my position to attempt to keep this thread on topic.
Moon worship has been practiced in Arabia since 2000 BC. The crescent moon is the most common symbol of this pagan moon worship as far back as 2000 BC.
In Mecca, there was a god named Hubal who was Lord of the Kabah.
This Hubal was a moon god.
One Muslim apologist confessed that the idol of moon god Hubal was placed upon the roof of the Kaba about 400 years before Muhammad. This may in fact be the origin of why the crescent moon is on top of every minaret at the Kaba today and the central symbol of Islam atop of every mosque throughout the world: About four hundred years before the birth of Muhammad one Amr bin Lahyo ... a descendant of Qahtan and king of Hijaz, had put an idol called Hubal on the roof of the Kaba. This was one of the chief deities of the Quraish before Islam. (Muhammad The Holy Prophet, Hafiz Ghulam Sarwar (Pakistan), p 18-19, Muslim)
.[/QUOTE]
hubal is a god like ancient romans and egyptions used to make up gods, and yes, it has been puteen, actually it's a statue, coz people in mecca and before Islam used to consider some statues that they made as gods.

.[/QUOTE]
The moon god was also referred to as "al-ilah". This is not a proper name of a single specific god, but a generic reference meaning "the god". Each local pagan Arab tribe would refer to their own local tribal pagan god as "al-ilah".
"al-ilah" was later shortened to Allah before Muhammad began promoting his new religion in 610 AD.
There is evidence that Hubal was referred to as "Allah".
When Muhammad came along, he dropped all references to the name "Hubal" but retained the generic "Allah".
Muhammad retained almost all the pagan rituals of the Arabs at the Kaba and redefined them in monotheistic terms.
.[/QUOTE]

here all is true, but ALLAH is the name of our god that has got no sons, and is only one... Ilah is in general, so there are many Ilahs, well, people thought so.

.[/QUOTE]
I attempt with all sincerity not to disrespect anyones beliefs as is suppose to be done this forum. If a question is disrespectful, then I accept that and will attempt to refute what has been asked. But if a question is an attempt to understand, that is another story and should be looked in upon. Unless it is the attempt of this forum that we should all come in with concieved notions and not be allowed to state them or have them altered if they are untrue.[/QUOTE]

my dearest, it's not like you think...we moslims use the moon to know the beginings of the months, while you cristians use the sun... and in a month called Ramadan, we make the moon a symbol for it, cuz we watch the two nights before that month, so we know when Ramadan begins....

We have only one God , who is Allah, and we don't consider a "statue" as a god or Idol, or even Symbol

[shadowy girl]

Salam alykom >> you know that is an arabic word, which meens peace upon you...

that is what we Moslims consider as a "Hi" in your language. ..

I'm a new member, yes, and I've seen so many wrong Ideas about Islam in this forum...

I am A Moslim, so I am ready to answer any of your questions about Islam, coz you know , I know many things, and I'm sure I can explain to you anything you don't understand about Islma...

but .. then I can ask you anything about Cristianity , and you have to answer, so we can have a little chat about religions, and a comparizim between Islam and other Religions...so we all get a pure Image about all religions, and WHO GOD REALLY IS.

so please, don't be too shy to ask, I'll be here every evening..:thumbs_up :blush:

SALAM ALEKOM, whis is also a "bye" in Islam

[optimisticnad]

My understanding of the religions of the book is they all have on message: and that is worship 'God', just the one 'God.' I've out 'God' in speech marks because in Christianity they didn't call him 'God', thats in English, not in Hebrew. So just like in Arabic it is 'Allah' it so in English 'God.'

The difference in religion arises from what Muslims calls 'shariah' which is basically ruling/laws. Each religion of the book came down with different laws for different times and different nations.

For example, Muslims believe that their Prophet Muhammad is the last Prophet, the 'seal of the Prophets' because after him no more Prophets will come. He bought the complete revelation and to this day even non-Muslims admit that not a syllable has been changed from the original, a copy still available. Muslims believe in Jesus and all the Prophets before him but they do not believe any Prophet, including Muhammad, is a son of God. Islam is based on one crucial concept: tawhid, which basically means oneness of God, he is unique and not like his creation so Muslims believe how can he have children, a son?

[Nightshade]

Actuallly though salam Allykum is used as hi and bye a great deal of deeper more wieghtly meaning attached to it. Salamallykum BTW, basically in its fullest form it is Actually Asalm Allykum wa rahmatil Allhi wa barkatuh.
Basically Peace to You and Gods Mercy and Blessings.
The Peace on you is more of Peace to you its sort like a truce. It dates back to the warlike nature of he Arabs pre islam . Because of how tribal and things they were they tened to have massive fueds and wars, but if they say Asalm Allykum it bsically means I come in peace and it promise not to kill/ try attak/ do any harm to the other person.
Another thing just to think about Muhammed peace be upon him said " The best of you is he who begins with the Salam" in other words he who starts in peace.

[Shield&Sword]

What do you mean by saying "all here is true" after you quoted the passage that say that "al ilah" was shortened to Allah and that Hubal was called Allah.
Allah name existed before the arabs made statues to worship. since the prophet Abraham peace be upon him, and infact if we look at the word God in hebrew we will find it "Iloheem" which is cloose to Allah, Iloheem is plural from of "El" which mean also God in hebrew, Jews use the plural from for 2 things: for numbers more than one and for respect same as in arabic and Iloheem is used for respect. Same thing in Aramic which is the language of Jesus peace be upon him, they say Alaaho the word is equal to arabic word Allah. And the one who read Quran will know that arabs didnt shortened Al ilah to Allah: Sura 39 verse 3:"Is it not to Allah that sincere devotion is due? But those who take for protectors others than Allah (say): "We only serve them in order that they may bring us nearer to Allah." Truly Allah will judge between them in that wherein they differ. But Allah guides not such as are false and ungrateful." As we see here Arabs always knew Allah but they started to worship stones so they get closer to Allah, it will be so stupid to say that arabs worshipped the statue Hubal and then they made other statues so they get them closer to Hubal. Hubal and all other statues were made for the same purpose which is to get closer to Allah the only one God.

[shadowy girl]

you know pretty much about Islam, thank really, but I didn't want to go too deep cuz I was very busy yesterday ...

[bazarov]

Can you search for my thread on this topic and write an answer?
Thanks!

[Scheherazade]

Shadowy Girl> There has already been a thread about questions about Islam so the thread you have started will be merged with that one. You can carry on your discussions there.

[shadowy girl]

Shadowy Girl> There has already been a thread about questions about Islam so the thread you have started will be merged with that one. You can carry on your discussions there.

sure I will, but I started it for general questions .... not about this spesific one!

[shadowy girl]

Can you search for my thread on this topic and write an answer?
Thanks!


sure, just ask, but I didn't find yours..

[Nightshade]

made statues to worship. since the prophet Abraham peace be upon him, and infact if we look at the word God in hebrew we will find it "Iloheem" which is cloose to Allah, Iloheem is plural from of "El" which mean also God in hebrew, Jews use the plural from for 2 things: for numbers more than one and for respect same as in arabic and Iloheem is u.

Do you know the story of the start of the Arabic languge?
Well presumably according to what know the 'modern' by this Im saying that which lead up to the arbic used in 750 AD around the time that mohmmed lived arbic languge stems directly from the tribes of Ismail, ( Abrhams son) . SO actually its not suprising to find strong similariteys in the languges as the jews, well alctually prejews this would be the sons of Israil ( who was also know if you didnt know as Jacob son of Issac son Abraham, who was also Joseph nd the other 11 sons father) would also have spoken a languge derived from that Abraham.

but on with the rest of what shield says

. And the one who read Quran will know that arabs didnt shortened Al ilah to Allah: Sura 39 verse 3:"Is it not to Allah that sincere devotion is due? But those who take for protectors others than Allah (say): "We only serve them in order that they may bring us nearer to Allah." Truly Allah will judge between them in that wherein they differ. But Allah guides not such as are false and ungrateful." As we see here Arabs always knew Allah but they started to worship stones so they get closer to Allah, it will be so stupid to say that arabs worshipped the statue Hubal and then they made other statues so they get them closer to Hubal. Hubal and all other statues were made for the same purpose which is to get closer to Allah the only one God.

You have to admit shield its understandable why someone would think that Allah is the shortened form of Al-Illah espcially if theyve ever seen them written , but yes ther is a differance mainly in that Allah is a proper noun.
As to the stautes, yes thats it. The ancient arabs apparntly originally built the idols as memorials and reminders of good pious people, so they could emulate them gradually they came to belive that these people where 'special' then that they had some kind of influence over God so they begane to pray to them and offer sacrifices in thier names so that they would petition God on thier behalf or forgive thier sins, from there it was a far leep to giving them powers and such. But I think they never actually belived that they were the highest gods just sort demmi gods as it were.

[bazarov]

sure, just ask, but I didn't find yours..
http://www.online-literature.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19106

[Scheherazade]

The thread Bazarov mentions has been closed because of constant references to current politics and certain personal comments.

I would like to repeat my last reminder in that thread here as well:

To All> This thread remains open only in good faith of the moderators because its subject matter is very sensitive and can be easily corrupted/turned into a political discussion, which is not permitted on our Forum. We still would like to believe the genuineness of the initial inquiry and the informative replies it will get as we are all here to share and learn from each other. Off-topic and political posts will lead to thread closure.

[Shield&Sword]

I will talk more about the arabic language only for more info.
The arabic language existed before Prophet Ibraheem peace be upon him. Prophets Hood and Salih peace be upon them were arabs but they didnt talk the "pure" arabic language that we talk now, the tribes that were talking arabic before Ibraheem peace be upon him are called Alarab Albae'da (its like the vanished arabic people). The first who talked the "PURE arabic" was prophet Ismaeel peace be upon him. The hebrew language as i know is derived fromt eh arabic language, thats why we find alot of similiraty between them and you can ask me i talk it so good, same thing aramic but hebrew is so poor language. Infact one of the most incient language would be the Syriania (as i remember), and looking at words in both arabic and syrianic we will find that there are alot of words comon in both. Hebrew and arabic language are not similar because Ismael and Isaac peace be upon thme were brothers but because both hebrew and modern arabic derive from same father which is the arabic language of Alarab Albae'eda the first form of arabic alot of years before Ibraheem peace be upon him.

Bazarov i thought i answered your questions in that thread and arrived to an important conclusion you can check again in the original thread.

[bazarov]

The thread Bazarov mentions has been closed because of constant references to current politics and certain personal comments.

I would like to repeat my last reminder in that thread here as well:

To All> This thread remains open only in good faith of the moderators because its subject matter is very sensitive and can be easily corrupted/turned into a political discussion, which is not permitted on our Forum. We still would like to believe the genuineness of the initial inquiry and the informative replies it will get as we are all here to share and learn from each other. Off-topic and political posts will lead to thread closure.

I know, so I would ask her to send me PM so nobody gets offended.
Sorry:)

[Nightshade]

I will talk more about the arabic language only for more info.
The arabic language existed before Prophet Ibraheem peace be upon him. Prophets Hood and Salih peace be upon them were arabs but they didnt talk the "pure" arabic language that we talk now, the tribes that were talking arabic before Ibraheem peace be upon him are called Alarab Albae'da (its like the vanished arabic people). The first who talked the "PURE arabic" was prophet Ismaeel peace be upon him. The hebrew language as i know is derived fromt eh arabic language, thats why we find alot of similiraty between them and you can ask me i talk it so good, same thing aramic but hebrew is so poor language. Infact one of the most incient language would be the Syriania (as i remember), and looking at words in both arabic and syrianic we will find that there are alot of words comon in both. Hebrew and arabic language are not similar because Ismael and Isaac peace be upon thme were brothers but because both hebrew and modern arabic derive from same father which is the arabic language of Alarab Albae'eda the first form of arabic alot of years before Ibraheem peace be upon him.
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Well thats actually what I meant, that is they spoke a smiliar languge as both languges had the same roots. But all in all thats really interesting to know:nod:

[B-Mental]

Please forgive me, if this has been asked before. Can someone explain the crescent moon's place in Islam. I understand its called the Hilal. Thanks for any help on this topic.

[Amra]

Muslim use the lunar calendar instead of the solar one. The calendar is 11 days shorter than the solar. Hilal is the crescent moon used to determine the beginning of a new month. The total number of months in the lunar calendar is 12.

[ashley3554]

The moon in Islam

1) The moon is prophet's Mohammad miracle; it was separated in to two separate equal peaces as a proof to his message which is Islam.

2) As dear Amra said :


Muslim use the lunar calendar instead of the solar one. The calendar is 11 days shorter than the solar. Hilal is the crescent moon used to determine the beginning of a new month. The total number of months in the lunar calendar is 12.

[Turk]

That's not true. Bible seller missionare website is lying. Before Muhammed SAV Arabs were believing Allah. Because it was Abraham's religion (they accept Abraham as ancestor of Arabs too). So there was a supreme God. But they were worshipping for some idols too (like Lat, Uzza, Men'at, Hubal) and claiming those idols making them closer to Allah.

At all, those claims that you've posted means nothing. Allah is the name we know our God. But he doesn't need names, specialities, and anything. WE NEED NAMES! If you are capable to understand this, then you realize the claims of missionare-christian people are completely meaningless.

And one last thing, Hz. Muhammed's flag didn't have crest symbol on it. In fact first flag of Muslims was a plain black with no symbols on it.

[Jamilah]

ALLAH is the Arabic word for God. The First, The Last, The Eternal. Muslims are sure to use this word when referring to God so as not to confuse Allah with deities also called "God." Allah has 99 names the three listed above come from that list. The list of 99 names is verified in the Qur'an and used by the Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him). It's interesting to note that in Aramaic, the language spoken by Jesus (PBUH), the word for God is Eloh. This is natural since both Aramaic (now a dead language) and Arabic are both semitic tongues. Allah (SWT) is also referred to as The Source of Peace, The Guardian, The Witness, The Sovereign, The Majestic, The Hidden and The Bestower of Forms and Shapes. It's wonderful reading. I recommend it highly.