Christianity and salvation

[peasoup]

I'm sorry if this kind of thread has been posted already. I was thinking recently about Christian beliefs of salvation gained by belief in Jesus.

"That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved." -Romans 10:9

Does that mean that people of other religions would all burn in hell? And what about all those uneducated tribes for example in Africa, which have not had exposure to Christinity and such? Are they condemmed simply becaude they have not had the opportunity to learn about Jesus and the Christian faith?

But if thats true than it contradicts statements like:

"And all mankind will see God's salvation." - Luke 3:6

I'd appreciate it if someone could clarify that for me.

[Chinaski]

Yes. Tough. Yes.

[rufioag]

Yes, the only way to reach salvation is to believe that Jesus died for our sins and was resurrected. Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me." (John 14:6) Now, many people have argued and asked, well what about babies, what about tribes who dont hear the word, etc, etc. Now, this is honestly a touchy subject and I honestly cant give u an answer.

As for Luke 3:6...the context for which the verse u drew upon is from the words of John the Baptist who is proclaiming the coming of the Messiah. So i think its talking about is that everyone will see the way to salvation through the Messiah. So, no it does not contradict the eaerlier statement.

But yes, if you believe in anything but Christianity, you are condemned to hell, even Jews who are Gods choosen people. It seems harsh to us but God has given us all the opportunity to understand and see the Truth.

[ShoutGrace]

Does that mean that people of other religions would all burn in hell? And what about all those uneducated tribes for example in Africa, which have not had exposure to Christinity and such? Are they condemmed simply becaude they have not had the opportunity to learn about Jesus and the Christian faith?

I'm sure that somewhere in Romans it is written that people are held accountable only for what they know. God has revealed his glory and presence throughout nature and the Universe. The bushman in deepest, darkest Africa will not and could not be held accountable for his reaction to the Gospel. Nor would a 4 year old who dies in a car crash. Would we expect anything less from an infinitely JUST, wise, RIGHTEOUS Creator?

If the bushman can get up everyday and think to himself (or feel in his heart), "Surely there is more than just I. I don't think I'm the center of the Universe. There must be something more." then God will judge according to that.

However, most of us have more chances than that bushman. We hear about Jesus in church, or wherever, at some point in our lives. I think that it comes down to seeking after and wishing to know God or rejecting and disbelieving in God. Concerning salvation, we each have to decide firstly about our own selves. I have to figure out what the Gospel means to me before I can get indignant about theological issues which can be reasoned with later. I once asked a friend of mine about what to say concerning this issue and he said "Tell them to worry about themselves first (before the other billions of people)." You have heard the Gospel and are reacting to it right now.

I still have to learn the full scope of Jesus' redemption. He said that Abraham saw his day and rejoiced. I'm wondering if he was saying that Abraham saw Jesus, or Abraham saw God (in which case Jesus is claiming to be God).

I think that it has been said that Jesus came to redeem all peoples (past, present, and future). Which means that devout Jews in 500 b.c. came to the Father through Jesus the Christ.

Jesus is the way, the truth and the life. He is each of these things for anyone who wishes to accept him. Yet Paul has told us that some will have eternal life without ever having heard the Gospel. So I think that sometimes it happens after death. A theist who lives in the Congo and dies at the age of 15 without ever seeing a Christian or holding a Bible in his hands will still have everlasting life with the help of Jesus.

God is just and wise. But He is also ultimately holy. How could we assume that what He is doing (and will do) is unfair? Every person will be judged and accounted for fairly and with all mercy. At the end of the age, no-one will be sitting around saying "Darn it this wasn't fair" or "Why didn't anyone try to evangelize me more?".

[Stanislaw]

Does that mean that people of other religions would all burn in hell? And what about all those uneducated tribes for example in Africa, which have not had exposure to Christinity and such? Are they condemmed simply becaude they have not had the opportunity to learn about Jesus and the Christian faith?

No, anyone has a chance at ataining God's kingdom. The qualifier is how your life was led...unselfishly, charitably, basically good, and that God grants you the ability to enter heaven.

Christians are not even granted such automatically, they must be given the ability by God, only God's compassion can decide.

[peasoup]

I'm sure that somewhere in Romans it is written that people are held accountable only for what they know. God has revealed his glory and presence throughout nature and the Universe. The bushman in deepest, darkest Africa will not and could not be held accountable for his reaction to the Gospel. Nor would a 4 year old who dies in a car crash. Would we expect anything less from an infinitely JUST, wise, RIGHTEOUS Creator?Yes, that sounds logical. I suupose that you're right about the fact that God would judge justly according to the amount of knowledge the person has.

But I'm still wondering about other religions. It's hard for me to believe that all people of religions different from Christinity would all just be dismissed with no chance at salvation. Because most of the time they don't choose to disbelieve in Christ, but rather choose to believe in their own religion.


No, anyone has a chance at ataining God's kingdom. The qualifier is how your life was led...unselfishly, charitably, basically good, and that God grants you the ability to enter heaven.
I pretty much agree with you Stanislaw, but then again does it not cortadict the thesis that only those who believe in the ressurection of Christ will find salvation?
That's exactly what i'm wondering about, because many realigions teach their followers to lead righteous lives, but would taht be enough in the eyes of God, since as it is said many times in the Bible, salvation only comes through Jesus.

[rufioag]

Christians believe that deeds are not the way to heaven, but faith and belief in Jesus Christ. And it is Jesus alone that allows Christians to have a personal relationship with God. "For all have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God." Without Jesus, the idea of a personal relationship would never exist. Praise be to Him, the last and final lamb, the greatest gift I have ever recieved. Salvation is amazing because God paid the ultimate price for a gift that is free to all.

[Chinaski]

Define 'personal relationship' please? And what's this gift then?

[ShoutGrace]

Define 'personal relationship' please? And what's this gift then?

You might want to check this (http://www.perspectivesjournal.org/2005/11/essay-relationship.php) link out. We as Christians often throw verbage around (myself more than anybody!) that can be confusing.

I think that the gift is grace. If you believe in what is written in the Bible, people are seriously flawed spiritual beings. And we are living in a natural and right world which has been seriously flawed. There is a tear in the moral fabric of existence that Jesus makes right. The Bible says that God is good and loving and that people haven't left it at that.

'Grace' is an infinitely holy and distinct God finding a way to let slimeball

"For all have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God."
people into his presence. Jesus is the fufillment of Jacob's ladder. As Christians we believe that the salvation for any person who has ever existed (before and after Jesus' earthly interlude) has ultimately come through his bridging the gap between human and ethereal.


Because most of the time they don't choose to disbelieve in Christ, but rather choose to believe in their own religion.

Jesus said that he was the answer. People who hear what He did and said and choose to lay their faiths and hopes elsewhere are saying that His Gospel isn't good enough. Or that it was pretty good but just doesn't seem ultimately true. Deliberately believing in any other "religion" (in which Jesus isn't foremost and neccessary and number 1) is essentially rejecting the heart of Jesus' message.

Jesus is exclusive. He said that it was "his way" or "'anything else". The New Testament epistles expound greatly on this point. For Jesus taught that absolute faith in his very person is all that is needed for salvation.

Christians will do good works. They must. The Bible teaches that from the day you confess that Jesus is Lord He literally enters you! Can anything be more radical than that? Every day each Christian is being transformed into the likeness of Christ, from the inside out. Jesus said that not everyone who cried out to him "Lord, Lord" would enter the kingdom of Heaven, only those who did the will of God (and there are many different explanations of this verse - but I don't think it in any way contradicts 'grace').

Good works in the face of disbelieving Jesus' Gospel are fruitless. Kind of like what I think I meant earlier. If someone has never even heard of God but would ultimately choose him, he will have the chance to accept Jesus and cross the gap. God knows men's hearts. Every person will have the chance to freely accept or reject him. But for those who have had the Gospel presented to them, the flavor is a little different. It's like those chances are happening right now. Every second we decide internally if we are going to either seek out the Maker or do anything else. C.S. Lewis wrote that in his Screwtape Letters. Something to the effect of

"Let the humans worry about whether or not it is right to burn candles or work on Sunday. Let them wonder and debate whether Communion is just symbolism or if the saltine crackers actually become Jesus' flesh. None of that really matters in the end. The bottom line is this - Are they trying to get closer to and better know and love God - or are they doing anything else? Every moment of every day are they getting closer to or farther away from the Creator?"