The Book 1984

[AJAZZAAARON]

Hi peoples i just read the book 1984 and i need help in explaining his character could someone please help me ASAP?

[ThatIndividual]

I'd love to talk about that! I just read it myself... What's up man? What are you wondering about? Let's get it started.

[MiSaNtHrOpE]

The main character, Winston Smith, is the only person besides his forbidden lover that knows whats going on. He would be just an ordinary guy in our world, but he's not, in his. He's a sane person in a mad world and he cant fix it. He longs for normal things: sex, emotional love, beer, sufficient food, etc. However, Big Brother denies these things, and on top of that, he works in the hypocritically-named Ministry of Truth, where his job is to falsify the news and historybooks to match what Big Brother says. 1984 is Pavlov's theory of conditioning to the cruelest limit, with the Two-Minutes Hate and the love for Newspeak, the linguistical impossibility of free thought.

[starrwriter]

I'll add one thing to Misanthrope's character analysis. I think the most poignant if pathetic insight comes after Winston Smith and his lover are arrested. When Smith is threatened with a particularly loathsome form of torture, he tells the Thought Police: "Do it to her, not me."

Orwell was telling us that everyone has his breaking point and that love does not conquer all.

[ThatIndividual]

Indeed, but let's not forget that Winston only gave her up after LOADS and LOADS of torture. In the beginning, that is when he was first taken to the ministry of love, he resolved to NEVER give her up and he stuck to that resolve throughout much horrible torture. But as you say, Orwell did mean to show that we all have our breaking point. I did however feel the need to defend Winston a bit because he didn't just give her up like that.

[insane10splayer]

Was this a good book? I have to read a classic for english. Does anyone recommend this book? It looked interesting

[starrwriter]

Was this a good book?
Is the Pope Catholic? 1984 is the greatest political novel of the 20th century.

[6079 Smith, W]

:nod: Hi, this is Donna, or Code Name Winston. I'd really like to talk to you about the book, because i love it and am reading in for the 3rd time after my english language teacher recommended it. I especially adore Winston Smith, a true hero, although conquered! Write back if u may!
W. :D :blush: ;)

[starrwriter]

:nod: Hi, this is Donna, or Code Name Winston. I'd really like to talk to you about the book, because i love it and am reading in for the 3rd time ... I especially adore Winston Smith, a true hero, although conquered!
Strange
So strange
Must be the season of the witch
--Donovan

[imprudentica]

I love talking about this book, too. It’s definitely one of my favorites, and I truly felt for Winston when at his breaking point, he didn’t even know what was wanted of him, anymore. That led me to some conclusions.

In the end, Winston was beaten and subjugated because he was alone in his desires and thoughts. However grandiose his ideas seemed to be, they were not sufficient to keep his human spirit alive, or to keep himself loyal to the one he said he loved. Yet, others in history have died, or endured terrible torments for their beliefs and passions, and I have a theory about that.

If one’s ideals are not well-grounded in something greater than carnal desire, or self-improvement, they can be conquered. Winston seems to have lost his fight because his personal desire for civil liberty was trumped by the immediate, irrevocable desire to alleviate great suffering. What greater desire for personal advantage could one have than to remove immediate suffering?

[starrwriter]

Winston seems to have lost his fight because his personal desire for civil liberty was trumped by the immediate, irrevocable desire to alleviate great suffering. What greater desire for personal advantage could one have than to remove immediate suffering?
Not sure I agree with your premise, if I understand it correctly. Wishing to alleviate the suffering of others is compassion, not "personal advantage." It's true he also wanted to be free himself, but I don't see how that detracts from compassion.

And let's not forget the Thought Police didn't really want to kill Winston. They wanted to make him love Big Brother and they succeeded by reducing him from an individual human to a Pavlovian reaction.

[subterranean]

Yes insane, it's a good one. In fact it's one of the best and must read books of all time. Even for those who doesn't consider reading as a hobby.


Was this a good book? I have to read a classic for english. Does anyone recommend this book? It looked interesting

[imprudentica]

Not sure I agree with your premise, if I understand it correctly. Wishing to alleviate the suffering of others is compassion, not "personal advantage." It's true he also wanted to be free himself, but I don't see how that detracts from compassion.

And let's not forget the Thought Police didn't really want to kill Winston. They wanted to make him love Big Brother and they succeeded by reducing him from an individual human to a Pavlovian reaction.

I agree with you that wishing to alleviate the suffering of others is to feel compassion. Unfortunately, your argument has no foundation. Where in the book did Winston try and alleviate the suffering of “others?” Winston ultimately wanted to be free to do the things he wanted to do, period.

[starrwriter]

I agree with you that wishing to alleviate the suffering of others is to feel compassion. Unfortunately, your argument has no foundation. Where in the book did Winston try and alleviate the suffering of “others?” Winston ultimately wanted to be free to do the things he wanted to do, period.
I think Orwell left no doubt in the reader's mind that Winston hated the totalitarian society he lived in and wanted to see it replaced by something better for everyone's benefit. But you're right, the actions he took were for his own personal freedom. I had the definite feeling he felt powerless as one individual to change his society as a whole. And some think the only way to change the world is one person at a time, starting with your own circumstances.

[6079 Smith, W]

:D You are absolutly right, starrwrite. It always has to start with ONE PERSON who rebels against something, the government for example. If every one indiviual does a little, in the end it is alot!:nod:
It is common sense, if one person stands up, others follow until everyone is standing up against an otherwise mighty force. But unfortunatly, it didn't really success in the book this time because all the records of rebells are being destroyed. Otherwise, Winston's act was heriotic and human. It shows us we should stand up to evil and injustice even though we might be the only one. It is better to stand up to something one knows deep down is wrong instead of just going with the flow because it is easier! ;) :yawnb:
Winston

[starrwriter]

It shows us we should stand up to evil and injustice even though we might be the only one. It is better to stand up to something one knows deep down is wrong instead of just going with the flow because it is easier!
Henry David Thoreau said an individual who is right is already a majority of one.

On the other hand, Winston's fate reminds me a little of the ending of the novel "The Spy Who Came In From The Cold." After realizing his side is just as evil as the other side, the disillusioned spy sacrifices his life to save a woman, but it is a sort of hollow sacrifice. He feels too disgusted to continue living.