December / Bulgakov Reading: Master and Margarita

[manolia]

Really nice It looks old

[bazarov]

It's 3 weeks old, it's brand new, still has that smell and it was expensive...

[Boris239]

The series is reasonably good, haven't seen the movie.

It's 3 weeks old, it's brand new, still has that smell and it was expensive...

It's cool- but some of my friends still have SamIzdat "M&M" from the times when it was not allowed and their parents were secretly giving it to their friends to read

[bazarov]

I am done with reading!

Bulgakov shows us that Levy Mathew does not understand much of Jeshua's teachings so what we have left is spoilt and changed version of the real thing- it is clearly the writer's view on the church. Btw, Bulgakov's father was a very well known religious philosopher.

I get the feeling he is making fun of theology whenever and wherever he can. That would make him against his father's opinion? Maybe they didn't like each other too much? Of course, he could also be satiric version of his father what would make him a good son.

Why Master does not deserve light only peace?

Eternal peace could be found only in death. Like Jeshua knew that; he asked Woland to take Master under his custody. Maybe it's satirical pointing on heaven and paradise like places of eternal good and light.

Who is your favorite from Woland's retinue? Mine without any doubt is Behemoth.

Agree totally. From chess playing, to gun shots, swimming in cognac, shooting spades and constant funny answers to Woland and Margarita...Poor black cats suffered because of him all over Moscow.

Who is Koroviev really? In the end he transforms into the knight who made a bad joke.

What does mean ''a bad joke''? He said it and then even tried to correct it and it was a failure. He didn't made it so it can't be something unpleasant or unhonorable like taking someone's wife or a murder.
To be honest, I think Boris knows the answer but he is teasing us? It should be something from Russian history, maybe that guy from Boris Godunov who said he is someone's son and he wasn't and he shouldn't be new tsar? Just maybe, because Bulgakov obviously liked Pushkin? Maybe very big maybe...

[bazarov]

Procurator and Afanasije are talking in the garden:

The visitor did not decline a second cup of wine, swallowed a few
oysters with obvious pleasure, tried some steamed vegetables, ate a piece of
meat. Having eaten his fill, he praised the wine:
'An excellent vintage. Procurator, but it is not Falerno?''
'Caecuba,thirty years old,' the procurator replied
courteously.

At the end, Azazello gives a bottle of wine to Master:

'And again I forgot!' cried Azazello, slapping himself on the forehead.
'I'm quite frazzled! Messire sends you a present,' here he adverted
precisely to the master, 'a bottle of wine. I beg you to note that it's the
same wine the procurator of Judea drank. Falernian wine.'
It was perfectly natural that such a rarity should arouse great
attention in both Margarita and the master.

Why is this changed? If it was a Azazello's mistake, Master would see it. But no, he and Margarita are delighted with that fact so they see it as a normal. What is a meaning of that?

[Boris239]

The problem ,Baz, is that as far as I know nobody knows who Koroviev really is. I've read about couple of versions- one was about the Albigonsian knight who compared the death of Simon de Monfor with the sunrise- i.e. comparing death with life- Woland tells us that the knight made a nbad joke about darkness and light. When I was an undergraduate I went to a literature professor who is actually one of the translators of "M&M"- she didn't know.

[manolia]

I won't read your few last posts, not yet since you are discussing something towards the end..
Anyway, i have just read the party scene. Perhaps the best chapter in my opinion

[bazarov]

Koroviev-Fagot/Dark Violet Knight
*As they leave Moscow each of the members of Woland's suite turns back into his original form. Koroviev turns out to be a knight in dark-purple who once made a bad pun about darkness and light. The inspiration for this character seems to come from Cervantes' novel Don Quixote which Bulgakov adapted for stage in 1938. In the novel the knight Sanson, in order to force his friend Don Quixote to return home and give up being a knight, disguises himself as the Knight of the White Moon and challenges him to a duel. He beats Don Quixote, who when forced to return home cannot bear the collapse of his fantasies and dies. In this way Sanson becomes the unwilling cause of Don Quixote's death. Bulgakov alters Cervantes' name from Samson to Sanson or Sun-son, the son of the sun. Here Bulgakov plays on the themes of light and dark since the knight connected with the sun commits a dark deed while Don Quixote who had gone mad, and in that way is connected with darkness, actually comes across as a figure of light. The knight's unsuccessful joke is connected with the theme of light and dark. This theme again plays in with the epigraph of the novel itself about willing evil but actually accomplishing good. The dark violet of Korovyev's armor symbolizes the mourning and death of the lovers and their passage to a different world. This color was used in this way in the poetry and prose of the Russian Symbolists, and in particular Andrei Bely's poem The Last Meeting. (Sokolov)

From Boris's site I told you he is teasing us!

[Etienne]

Ohh that does make sense, and is quite amazing! Koroviev is Samson! Wow, I have to read it again just for that I think!

[bazarov]

My dear Ettiene...

[Etienne]

Ok, I admit I already wanted to read it again, and I probably won't do it because I'll read books I haven't read yet, but at least it let me express my amazement... oh forget it!

[Boris239]

Well, this is only one of the versions. I can't say that I fully agree with it. Even though the site is very good, it doesn't mean that everything there is true

[bazarov]

Well, this is only one of the versions. I can't say that I fully agree with it. Even though the site is very good, it doesn't mean that everything there is true

True.

He could be Sanson Carasco, but I don't think Sanson did anything wrong; he helped to poor Don. Or is it because Don didn't want that help and it ruined him and that's the reason of Koroviev's guilt? Or Sanson did good but Bulgakov twisted it like he normally does?


Ettiene, sorry; I thought you're sarcastic again.

[annakarina]

Hi all, I am new to the forum and would just like to know, by when do we have to have read this book? It is probably stated quite clearly somewhere; in that case I apologise in advance for being thick.

[Alexei]

Hi all, I am new to the forum and would just like to know, by when do we have to have read this book? It is probably stated quite clearly somewhere; in that case I apologise in advance for being thick.

Hi, Annakarina, welcome to the forum You don't have to apologize at all. I think there isn't any deadline so don't worry. The discussion has already more or less started and you can join in as soon as you finish it. I haven't finish it yet too. Anyway I recommend you to finish it as soon as possible - it is such a great book, I love it