March '10 Reading: Steppenwolf by Hesse

[applepie]

I picked my copy up from the library yesterday. Hopefully I'll start reading today sometime.

[Dark Muse]

He returns to the idea of suicide later on too.

On the idea of the steppenwolf dichotomy, the treatise does say that it is a simplification, and that in reality an individual has many minds. I think this refers to Hesse's contact with Asian religions, especially Buddhism, which abides by such concepts. Haller himself later refers to discussions he had with an academic of Asian studies who discussed Hinduism and Krishna. Haller says that he has done with Hinduism, as Hesse did in real life with Hinduism and Buddhism, but I think the ideas and methods still affected Hesse.

I have just read the part where it talks of the multiple individualities of man, and speaks directly about the Asian influences and concepts upon this sort of multiple personality of men, and the countless number of "souls" or "individuals" which inhibit one body.

It was all quite fascinating, though it did make me wonder as to just what the book is then trying to convey. If the whole concept of the Steppenwolf it itself nothing but an illusion, or a lie, and if in fact in truth Harry is not really split between man and wolf, for he is made of countless parts, than just what is the purpose behind the telling of this story?

For the Steppenwolf seems then in contradiction to the truth of the unlimited selves. It seems to me thus far, that Harry, and those like him, have an awareness enough above others, to know that they are more than just a man, or a single man, and yet they cannot comprehend the full scope of the truth, and so they become limited into feeling divided into two different parts.

The use of the wolf in particular in this idea as the personification as one of the many possible identities of man, I do think is a refection of Western influence and the importance of the Wolf in German, and European culture in general and what the wolf has come to symbolize and the fact both physically as well as spiritually wolves have a long history of being linked to man.

[Paulclem]

I have just read the part where it talks of the multiple individualities of man, and speaks directly about the Asian influences and concepts upon this sort of multiple personality of men, and the countless number of "souls" or "individuals" which inhibit one body.

It was all quite fascinating, though it did make me wonder as to just what the book is then trying to convey. If the whole concept of the Steppenwolf it itself nothing but an illusion, or a lie, and if in fact in truth Harry is not really split between man and wolf, for he is made of countless parts, than just what is the purpose behind the telling of this story?

For the Steppenwolf seems then in contradiction to the truth of the unlimited selves. It seems to me thus far, that Harry, and those like him, have an awareness enough above others, to know that they are more than just a man, or a single man, and yet they cannot comprehend the full scope of the truth, and so they become limited into feeling divided into two different parts.

The use of the wolf in particular in this idea as the personification as one of the many possible identities of man, I do think is a refection of Western influence and the importance of the Wolf in German, and European culture in general and what the wolf has come to symbolize and the fact both physically as well as spiritually wolves have a long history of being linked to man.

Do you think that the social wolf aspect of Haller is being compromised by his conception of himself as a Steppenwolf - a more lonely figure? I've read on further, and Hermine, whom he meets later, does take him out of himself, and introduces him to a more bohemian style of life.

In Hesse's introduction, he talks of healing in the book, which has been misconstrued by readers. I can see why the themes in the book would appeal to 60s bohemian types - different from the common run, hating the bourgeois, intellectual, but with free love and an uncommitted lifestyle, as both Hermine and Haller currently have.

[Dark Muse]

I cannot help but to notice some curious parallels between Steppenwolf and Sidhartha as I am reading the book. It seems in very different ways Hesse is dealing and struggling with some of the same issues.

The way in which the Steppenwolf is cast out from society, ostracized by his own family, and left an outcast in every way, reminds me of Siddhartha's own rejection of his family name and wealth to go upon his quest to obtain a deeper meaning and understanding and try and discover the "truth"

While with Siddhartha it was much more of an active and conscious choice, while for the Steppenwolf it seems more something that happens to him of which he does not have a choice in. It is interesting that it says that each time the Steppenwolf is exiled there comes with it a gain in more depth, and some deeper spiritual meaning, yet there is also an increase in loneliness.

I also cannot help but to notice there seems to be a strong bitterness towards the bourgeoisie within the books. Is this because of their materialism? The fact that they are so "blind" to the deeper understanding and meaning, and are concerned with their own illiusional realities, the fact that they cannot see past their own lives and thus do not see the greater human suffering?

Both Sidhartha and Steppenwolf seem to be strongly concerned with ideas relating to human suffering, while Siddhartha goes on a quest to find a spiritual path to try and alleviate human suffering, the Steppenwolf is unable to find peace. He seems tortured, trapped between two different worlds.

He cannot be content in the bourgeoisie any longer, and is not accepted among them, because he has had a glimmer of the truth, and a touch of deeper awareness that sets him apart, and keeps him from being content with bourgeoisie luxuries, yet at the same time because he still cannot see the full scope of the truth, and feels divided within himself, he still longs for those bourgeoisie things which fail to truly fulfill him or give him pleasure.

[Paulclem]

I cannot help but to notice some curious parallels between Steppenwolf and Sidhartha as I am reading the book. It seems in very different ways Hesse is dealing and struggling with some of the same issues.

The way in which the Steppenwolf is cast out from society, ostracized by his own family, and left an outcast in every way, reminds me of Siddhartha's own rejection of his family name and wealth to go upon his quest to obtain a deeper meaning and understanding and try and discover the "truth"

While with Siddhartha it was much more of an active and conscious choice, while for the Steppenwolf it seems more something that happens to him of which he does not have a choice in. It is interesting that it says that each time the Steppenwolf is exiled there comes with it a gain in more depth, and some deeper spiritual meaning, yet there is also an increase in loneliness.

I also cannot help but to notice there seems to be a strong bitterness towards the bourgeoisie within the books. Is this because of their materialism? The fact that they are so "blind" to the deeper understanding and meaning, and are concerned with their own illiusional realities, the fact that they cannot see past their own lives and thus do not see the greater human suffering?

Both Sidhartha and Steppenwolf seem to be strongly concerned with ideas relating to human suffering, while Siddhartha goes on a quest to find a spiritual path to try and alleviate human suffering, the Steppenwolf is unable to find peace. He seems tortured, trapped between two different worlds.

He cannot be content in the bourgeoisie any longer, and is not accepted among them, because he has had a glimmer of the truth, and a touch of deeper awareness that sets him apart, and keeps him from being content with bourgeoisie luxuries, yet at the same time because he still cannot see the full scope of the truth, and feels divided within himself, he still longs for those bourgeoisie things which fail to truly fulfill him or give him pleasure.

Yes, I'd agree with that. Siddhartha. Steppenwolf and The Glass Bead Game - which I have started, but stopped in order to read this - are concerned with outsiders. I think ther's a bit of Nietzche - in there too, though I am only broadly aware of his idea of the superman.

In the Glass bead game the start is about an academic elite that have adopted an almost monastic lifestyle - so he is exploring the idea of an outsider and how they could be accommodated within society. They dedicate themselves to academia - much like celibate monks. (I'm looking forward to going back to the Glass Bead Game after this - it is fascinating).

Siddhartha is an elective outsider - a bit like The Buddha - who left house and home and family. The Steppenwolf seems to have acepted his lot as an outsider. He can't seem to stomach a bourgeois lifestyle, though he does have a fondness for them as he says in the beginning.

The Bohemianism also comes through, and this has a touch if the Nietzchean superman in it as there are drugs, free love and a hedonistic lifestyle involved. There isn't much judgement, just the constant awareness by the \Steppenwolf - even as he is throwing himself into the lifestyle, that it is hollow, and that his calling is deeper.

[Jazz_]

Just started today, it's already interesting and enjoyable - glad it won

[Virgil]

I started today too. I read the preface. It is interesting. But did that Preface narrator just give us all the themes up front? Seems like he explained it all. Also, yikes - there are no chapters after the preface.

[Dark Muse]

I started today too. I read the preface. It is interesting. But did that Preface narrator just give us all the themes up front? Seems like he explained it all. Also, yikes - there are no chapters after the preface.

I did not even read the Preface. Yeah, books that do not have any chapters, or other convenient stopping points can be a bit difficult. Also I am usually not a huge fan of books with paragraphs that last like an entire page or two long. Though I am still loving this book and completely fascinated.

[the facade]

Hey, I'm new here and I was very content to see that this book was chosen as it happens to be the one I'm currently reading.

So far it's amazing. Will get back to you guys once I'm finished!

[Paulclem]

Tha narrative stye is interesting in that Hesse validates the narrator through Haller himself, which is unlike the unreliable narrator in The Turn of the Screw for example.

He is painted as such a solid and perhaps narrow minded young man that he couldn't possibly have made it up.

[applepie]

I started today too. I read the preface. It is interesting. But did that Preface narrator just give us all the themes up front? Seems like he explained it all. Also, yikes - there are no chapters after the preface.

My copy had an intro by the author that I read. It was pretty interesting. He specifically said that most people don't really get the message of the book. He wouldn't reveal what it was, but Hesse went on to talk about people seeing the story in an entirely different light than what he meant.

[Dark Muse]

I do not know much about Hesse's personal life, I have a bio on him floating around here somewhere but have yet to pick it up and read, but with all the references to Asian and Eastern studies and research that are mentioned within Steppenwolf, do you think that Hesse saw something of himself in Haller?

[Virgil]

I did not even read the Preface. Yeah, books that do not have any chapters, or other convenient stopping points can be a bit difficult. Also I am usually not a huge fan of books with paragraphs that last like an entire page or two long. Though I am still loving this book and completely fascinated.

Oh I know what you mean about the typical Preface. This is not a typical preface, but part of the novel. You need to go back and read it.

My copy had an intro by the author that I read. It was pretty interesting. He specifically said that most people don't really get the message of the book. He wouldn't reveal what it was, but Hesse went on to talk about people seeing the story in an entirely different light than what he meant.

Yes, mine did too. I thought that was interesting. That's not the preface i mean, by the way. That's the author's introduction.

[Dark Muse]

Oh I know what you mean about the typical Preface. This is not a typical preface, but part of the novel. You need to go back and read it.

Well after what you said, I think I rather wait until I get to the end before reading the preface. I don't think I want it all spilled out to me up fornt. I am enjoying the epxerirence of it.

[Virgil]

Well after what you said, I think I rather wait until I get to the end before reading the preface. I don't think I want it all spilled out to me up fornt. I am enjoying the epxerirence of it.

Ok, but I assume Hesse wanted people to read that first. I guess you're so far along it doesn't make a difference at this point.