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Thread: A Clockwork Orange: Anthony Burgress

  1. #16
    The Poetic Warrior Dark Muse's Avatar
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    Most the slang is acutally in russian, the book uses a lot of russian words for things, but you can find glossories that help guide you along.
    Last edited by Dark Muse; 05-22-2008 at 11:05 AM.

    Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there, wondering, fearing, doubting, dreaming dreams no mortal ever dared to dream before. ~ Edgar Allan Poe

  2. #17
    Registered User kat.'s Avatar
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    aaah...ok.....so i'll give it a try and then I'll let you know....Thanks a lot and have a nice day

  3. #18
    Bibliophile Drkshadow03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBI View Post
    Well, did you read the American or British edition? The British one has an extra chapter, which was cut from the American one for being too optimistic (a move I agree with).
    I read the British, but saw the movie first and read the intro essay where Burgess talks about the addition of the last chapter cut from the American version. This is one of those cases where I think the author is plain wrong about his text, and hasn't thought about it.

    I think the British version is far more depressing. There is nothing particularly optimistic about it. It gives the illusion of optimism. Alex never really changes. He abandons his life of violence, but not for the right reasons. It is this reason that the extra chapter is more depressing. His reasons are simple: violence has grown boring. He outgrows his violent childhood, but never shows remorse for it. He never once empathizes with his victims. He never once feels sorry for the people he hurt. The story never stops being about Alex, never about the people he hurt, not even when he decides to abandon that life. There isn't even a moment reflection beyond I'm bored with this.

    It's for this reason that the extra chapter is in fact darker and more pessimistic. He starts out a complete narcissist and ends a narcissist. That's what I think most people completely miss when they read the story (an important point, however); they notice the superficial change in the last chapter, but they fail to notice his REASONS for changing, and when you really start pondering them it becomes apparent that in fact not only has Alex not changed at all, but it makes it even darker than the 20 chapter ending.

    I had some thoughts on this a little while ago on the blog
    "You understand well enough what slavery is, but freedom you have never experienced, so you do not know if it tastes sweet or bitter. If you ever did come to experience it, you would advise us to fight for it not with spears only, but with axes too." - Herodotus

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  4. #19
    A ist der Affe NickAdams's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Muse View Post
    Yeah, sense reading the book I began using NADSAT myself
    Hard to avoid. I wrote my location in NADSAT after reading the book.

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  5. #20
    The Poetic Warrior Dark Muse's Avatar
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    I would have to agree. I do not think this ending was very optomistic at all. Really it is rather sad. Alex does not really learn anything nor does he reform, or truly feel bad for anything he has done. He never truly has a problem with violence, he just gets older so it does not really entertain him any more as it use to.

    In fact he even says something about how the violence was just a part of being young, and talks about how if he has his son his son will do the same things he did, but he does not seem to be bothered at all by that idea.

    Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there, wondering, fearing, doubting, dreaming dreams no mortal ever dared to dream before. ~ Edgar Allan Poe

  6. #21
    Bibliophile JBI's Avatar
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    It isn't optimistic about the character, but optimistic about society. Instead of him keeping going with his disgusting life style, he "matures" out of it, a move I disagree with on Borges' part. Society wouldn't make him mature, it is optimistic to think time fixes these problems, when really he should have gone on being a sick disturbed narcissistic murdering rapist.

  7. #22
    The Poetic Warrior Dark Muse's Avatar
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    I do not really see it as being optimistic on society, because the violence will perpetuate through the Alex Jr.'s of the world, so the problem is not truly be resolved at all, even if he does "mature" his attitude is the same, and so he will not discourage the behavior in his children, so the violence will continue.

    Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there, wondering, fearing, doubting, dreaming dreams no mortal ever dared to dream before. ~ Edgar Allan Poe

  8. #23
    I *asked* for my account to be "deleted"
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    Quote Originally Posted by kat. View Post
    I really want to read this one....but as you just wrote there#s a lot of slang in it....I guess I will kind of struggle for my English
    most of the slang here are derived from russian

  9. #24
    Registered User kat.'s Avatar
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    unfortunately I don't know Russian

  10. #25
    Registered User Moses25's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Loved this book. It was real horrorshow.

    Made my golova be filled with all kinds of chepooka.

    Cheers.

  11. #26
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    I read it translated to spanish -in most cases, this is what I do-, and I didn't like it as much as I liked the movie. I think it is a good piece of work, but I don't like that famous last chapter at all -I think Kubrick did not, also-. It is far too innocent to think that a boy like Alex would stop being a criminal at the age of eighteen. Come on, that is childish. What did the author think? That a criminal is a criminal because he is not old enough to notice? Besides, that nadsat thing is formidable.
    'Each of us has Heaven and Hell in him'

  12. #27
    archivist extraordinaire AlysonofBathe's Avatar
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    I first read this when I was 14, and oh man was that a fun conversation with my parents - "What you reading there, dear?" "A Clockwork Orange!" And then my mother burst into flames. :P

    Seriously though, I adore this book. I've read it a handful of times since and it's just so twisted and wonderful. As to the nadsat, I would suggest using a glossary only if you're really struggling; not understanding it and having to work with associations and context really adds to the alienation affect.

    Cheers,
    Alyson
    Alyson of Bathe's feeble attempt at completing the 1001 books challenge. You would think a former English major would have a better start than this. For the Reading.

  13. #28
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    its many years since i read clockwork orange. I seem to remember reading that anthony burgess created a fictional slang because he didn't want the novel to become dated. It also seems to be floating around my recollection that the slang sounded russian. I prefer the ending to the film, if i remember, because there's something of a mystery to it, rather than the book in which alex decides to become a 'decent' citizen. Perhaps burgess felt it would be unsatisfactory for alex to simply return to his 'pre clockwork' state. The novel does resonate with anxieties about crime and i think there are many who would think a criminal having their free will compromised in the way alex did might actually be rather liberal.

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