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Thread: Is There Any Evidence For Any Psychic Phenomena?

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    Is There Any Evidence For Any Psychic Phenomena?

    Let us be as inclusive as possible and still maintain some kind of rigor.

    Is there any evidence other than personal acounts for:

    Abominable snowmen
    acupuncture
    alien abductions
    amulets
    angels
    apparitions
    astral travel
    astrology
    augury
    automatic handwriting
    banshees
    Bermuda triangle
    bigfoot
    black cats
    boogey men
    broken mirrors
    brownies
    channeling
    clairvoyance
    crop circles
    curses
    demigods
    demons
    devil
    divination
    Einsteinian vortices (confusion hill)
    elves
    EMTs
    extra sensory perception
    extraterrestial beings
    fairies
    faith healers
    fire starters
    fortune telling
    four leaf clover
    Frankensteins
    Friday the 13th
    ghosts
    ghouls
    Glossolalia (speaking in tongues)
    Goblins
    God
    hauntings
    heaven
    hell
    hex
    hobs
    immortality
    imps
    incantations
    incubae
    jinx
    Jonah
    karma
    kirilian photography
    ladders (don't walk under them)
    leprechauns
    leviathans
    levitations
    life after death
    lochness monster
    lucky charms
    madame Blavatsky
    magic
    magnetic bracelets
    mermaids
    miracles
    mummy
    necromancy
    Noah's ark
    Nostrodamus
    numerology
    omens
    ouija boards
    palm reading
    phantom
    phrenology
    pixies
    poltergeists
    possession
    prayer
    precognition
    prescience
    prognostication
    prophecy
    psychic healing
    psychic surgery
    pyramid power
    rabbit's foot
    reincarnation
    saints
    Santa Claus
    sťance
    shades
    soothsayer
    specters
    spells
    spirits
    sprites
    soul
    succubae
    Tai chi
    talisman
    telekinesis
    telepathy
    theosophy
    time travel
    transcendental meditation
    transmigration of souls
    trolls
    ufos
    undead
    unicorns
    Uri Geller
    vampires
    virgin birth
    voodoo
    warlocks
    werewolves
    wights
    witches
    wizards
    wraiths
    yeti
    yin and yang
    zombies

    * In mathematics when you multiply two negatives you get a positive. So I am wondering, if I walk under a ladder indoors with an open umbrella, should I expect good luck?

    Does anyone know of experiments that were conducted rigorously, showed statistically significant results and were repeated multiple times to confirm the results?
    Last edited by desiresjab; 10-15-2016 at 06:16 AM.

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    Registered User North Star's Avatar
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    I've seen plenty of trolls over the Internet, and Santa Claus dressed as my grandpa. Friday the 13th is real, too. The last one was in May this year, next one will be in October next year. There seem to be one to three of the m in any given year. Undoubtedly some superstitious will act in a way that causes them misfortune on those days, and people will also note the date on those days if something bad happens to them.

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    Registered User Jackson Richardson's Avatar
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    As Samuel Johnson said "It is wonderful that five thousand years have now elapsed since the creation of the world, and still it is undecided whether or not there has ever been an instance of the spirit of any person appearing after death. All argument is against it; but all belief is for it."
    Previously JonathanB

    The more I read, the more I shall covet to read. Robert Burton The Anatomy of Melancholy Partion3, Section 1, Member 1, Subsection 1

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    Registered User Jackson Richardson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by desiresjab View Post
    Let us be as inclusive as possible and still maintain some kind of rigor.

    Is there any evidence other than personal acounts for:
    prayer
    Does anyone know of experiments that were conducted rigorously, showed statistically significant results and were repeated multiple times to confirm the results?
    I presume the question is whether there any evidence that intercessory prayer makes things happen. That is completely misunderstanding any Christian understanding of prayer, which is no magic technique to persuade God. It is a relationship with God and God is beyond scientific proof, as God by definition beyond any existence.

    But there is plenty of other sorts of prayer, particularly contemplative prayer, which need no scientific research to justify them.
    Previously JonathanB

    The more I read, the more I shall covet to read. Robert Burton The Anatomy of Melancholy Partion3, Section 1, Member 1, Subsection 1

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    Maybe YesNo's Avatar
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    Yes, there is evidence for psi phenomena. See Dean Radin's texts or check out the following reference list: http://deanradin.com/evidence/evidence.htm

    The way I see it, anyone who does not accept this evidence is anti-scientific.

    As far as seeing ghosts go, I've seen one myself. I know that is anecdotal, but there are many other people who have reported shared death experiences, near dear experiences and after death communications. Again, these are all anecdotal, but that doesn't mean they didn't happen.

    If this kind of phenomena is real it is not going to be something that one can objectify into an unconscious technology, but that doesn't mean it isn't real.
    Last edited by YesNo; 10-15-2016 at 10:57 AM.

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    Card-carrying Medievalist Lokasenna's Avatar
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    It is curious that all human cultures, however separate in time and space, develop a consistent belief in the supernatural. It is also curious how many of these beliefs overlap - almost every culture, for example, has the concept of ghosts.

    That being said, scientific evidence is thin on the ground. James Randi has, since the early 1960s, offered a million dollars to anyone who can demonstrate any sort of supernatural manifestation under laboratory conditions, and nobody has yet claimed it - despite the many thousands of people world wide who claim to have paranormal abilities.
    "I should only believe in a God that would know how to dance. And when I saw my devil, I found him serious, thorough, profound, solemn: he was the spirit of gravity- through him all things fall. Not by wrath, but by laughter, do we slay. Come, let us slay the spirit of gravity!" - Nietzsche

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    Quote Originally Posted by YesNo View Post
    Yes, there is evidence for psi phenomena. See Dean Radin's texts or check out the following reference list: http://deanradin.com/evidence/evidence.htm

    The way I see it, anyone who does not accept this evidence is anti-scientific.

    As far as seeing ghosts go, I've seen one myself. I know that is anecdotal, but there are many other people who have reported shared death experiences, near dear experiences and after death communications. Again, these are all anecdotal, but that doesn't mean they didn't happen.

    If this kind of phenomena is real it is not going to be something that one can objectify into an unconscious technology, but that doesn't mean it isn't real.
    So skeptics are not allowed in your world? If there was undeniable evidence, someone would have claimed Randi's prize, like Loki said. No one has. I do not see a lot of other scientist's on board with this fringe's contentions, so accroding to you most scientists are anti-scientific. There must be some powerful names on that list who are anti-scientific.

    You provided about 200 links, way too many. I have read one so far. When an enthusiast writes up the results of someone else's study, I have a reason to be skeptical. It might be noted that the someone else in this case is an enthusiast, as well.

    I do not know what accounts for dogs seeming to know when their owners are returning home, when every effort seems to have been made by experimenters to make that time random and unpredictable.

    It appears that either the experimenters have forgotten to account for something, or dogs have a degree of what we call broadly ESP. Those are my two main suspects.

    If past is precedent and the latter proves true, we will be using ESP in commercial and military applications long before we understand it well.

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    Lokasenna, you came up with thoughts that have to be addressed. Take your first sentence. The Vikings may have been far removed in space and time from the Etruscans, but they were both primitive and pre-scientific. The headwaters of all cultures begin in the dark long ago, huddled around a campfire, listening to unknown sounds. It is from ancient sources that most of our superstitions hail. I do not really want to count Slenderman and other urban myths as the same thing. Millions of people can be made to believe something stupid by a post that goes viral.

    People around that ancient campfire did the best they could, which was to anthropomorphsise everything. If lightning was being cast from the sky, then someone was casting it. Those ancient people had no tools, absolutely no way to reasonably explain the mechanics of things around them. If a tree branch fell and killed a member of their tribe, some conscious personality did that, too.

    To human beings, superstitions are like the water the little Dutch boy does not have enough thumbs and fingers to hold back. Social media has proven that new breeds of superstition can be invented and disseminated rapidly to take root. They may differ somewhat from ancient superstitions, especially in the minds of the holders', but I would wager there is a substantial amount of commonality.
    Last edited by desiresjab; 10-15-2016 at 11:39 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson Richardson View Post
    I presume the question is whether there any evidence that intercessory prayer makes things happen. That is completely misunderstanding any Christian understanding of prayer, which is no magic technique to persuade God. It is a relationship with God and God is beyond scientific proof, as God by definition beyond any existence.

    But there is plenty of other sorts of prayer, particularly contemplative prayer, which need no scientific research to justify them.
    In fact, the most recent experiment I read from Yes/No's monster link list was a study concerning the effects of intercessory prayer on hospital patients with bloodstream infections. Everything was randomized, double-blinded etc. They say they acheived significant results and list them along with the data and experiment design. A few percent difference is a significant result. I do not doubt their integity. But I do have to wonder what is going on.

    Out of these several hundred links, I doubt I will find a single study not acheiving significant results in the positive direction. So what is going on? Are that many scientists unconsciously designing experiments that are biased?

    Brian Josephson is a scientist of first rank who has been a huge advocate of parapsychological research since the 1970s. He is a big believer in ESP. Yet, why has someone of Joshephson's rank not stepped forward to announce results and claim Randi's $1,000,000 dollar prize? He has suffered many slings and arrows from the scientific establishment for his beliefs. He must feel he does not have anything yet, but these other scientists feel that they do. What is going on here?
    Last edited by desiresjab; 10-15-2016 at 11:50 PM.

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    Registered User Jackson Richardson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by desiresjab View Post
    In fact, the most recent experiment I read from Yes/No's monster link list was a study concerning the effects of intercessory prayer on hospital patients with bloodstream infections. Everything was randomized, double-blinded etc
    Since the prayers are offered out of love for the patients nor out of faith in God, just to show how clever you are, it isn’t Christian prayer.
    Previously JonathanB

    The more I read, the more I shall covet to read. Robert Burton The Anatomy of Melancholy Partion3, Section 1, Member 1, Subsection 1

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson Richardson View Post
    Since the prayers are offered out of love for the patients nor out of faith in God, just to show how clever you are, it isn’t Christian prayer.
    Because you say so?

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    Did you mean to say:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson Richardson View Post
    Since the prayers are not offered out of love for the patients nor out of faith in God, just to show how clever you are, it isn’t Christian prayer.
    It does not say they paid the one who prayed. The person might have done it out of philia.
    Last edited by desiresjab; 10-16-2016 at 06:04 AM.

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    Maybe YesNo's Avatar
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    When I hear Randi mentioned I think of Rupert Sheldrake's comments on him and his prize:



    Much of what we believe is based on assertions and we follow various herds in our thinking. That is, we ground ourselves in theories. If the evidence goes against our chosen theories we reject the evidence. I do this myself. I am not trying to point a finger at anyone with this comment.

    A scientific mentality would more quickly reject a theory than a herd mentality. However, it is not easy to know what the evidence actually is even in something not psi related. We have to be open to cognitive dissonance which is a painful experience, but there is no other way out of a cultural box.

    For example, does "dark matter" exist? The current herd thinking assumes it exists and so people start looking for it. All the herd has to do is change the theory and the need to fund research to search for dark stuff vanishes. At the moment, I don't think there is any evidence for dark matter. At some point we will stop looking for it. Or find it. Or say we found it when we haven't.
    Last edited by YesNo; 10-16-2016 at 02:11 PM.

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    Registered User Jackson Richardson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by desiresjab View Post
    Did you mean to say:



    It does not say they paid the one who prayed. The person might have done it out of philia.

    I understood you to say that they were praying to prove a scientific experiment.
    Previously JonathanB

    The more I read, the more I shall covet to read. Robert Burton The Anatomy of Melancholy Partion3, Section 1, Member 1, Subsection 1

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    Registered User Jackson Richardson's Avatar
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    By Christian prayer I was thinking of the Garden of Gethsemane:

    And (Jesus) went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.

    Those who were experimenting to see if prayer “works” seemed to regard intercessory prayer as a form of magic.
    Previously JonathanB

    The more I read, the more I shall covet to read. Robert Burton The Anatomy of Melancholy Partion3, Section 1, Member 1, Subsection 1

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