Theosophy

[free]

I am very faintly acquainted with theosophy. I have met the term in some novel. How much do you know it and what do you think about it?

[YesNo]

I don't know much about it although I've heard of the term.

I just watched the video on https://theosophical.org/ and I realized I used to live near their center many years ago and I do remember passing it by wondering what was going on there but never stopping in. I should probably drive back to that area some weekend and see what I missed.

[Mohammad Ahmad]

Well, I think the theosophy is any of several religious philosophies based on mysticism and meditation.
Furthermore, take this overall classification:
It is a religious philosophy associating with mystical concerns can be traced to the ancient world.

It holds that God, whose essence pervades the universe as an absolute reality, can be known only through mystical experience (see mysticism). It is characterized by esoteric doctrine and an interest in occult phenomena. Theosophical beliefs are found in Neoplatonism, Gnosticism, and among students of the Kabbala, but Jakob Böhme, who developed a complete theosophical system, is often called the father of modern theosophy. Today theosophy is associated with the Theosophical Society, founded by Helena Blavatsky in 1875. See also Annie Besant.
After all this brief formation, I had to ask myself:
Is this philosophical notion entitled as "theosophy" going to include the Islamic Sufi?
The Sufi in Islam also is adopting the Mystical Movement, which it is nearer to the above classification.
Second notice:
I think- as it is always my own thought- that the origin of this word (Theosophy) comes from two words:
Theo --- theory
Sophy --- from Sufi which changed to Sophy

[Pompey Bum]

I think- as it is always my own thought- that the origin of this word (Theosophy) comes from two words:
Theo --- theory
Sophy --- from Sufi which changed to Sophy

No, it comes from the Greek theos, which means God, and the Greek sophia, which means wisdom. (Sophia was also a goddess of wisdom). In my opinion, the term should be abandoned because of its cultural associations with Madame Blavatsky, who in turn has become a byword for fashionable occult humbug. But yes, Sufi certainly falls within the realm of mystic wisdom traditions.

[Jackson Richardson]

I would take Theosophy to refer to the Theosophical Society, associated with Madame Blavatsky. More details here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theosophical_Society

So Theosophy might include Sufi teachings, but Sufiism is not Theosophical in that (original) sense.

Rudolf Steiner was secretary of the Theosophicl Society, but developed his theories which gave a greater importance to Jesus Christ and founded the Anthroposophical Society, ie Wisdom (Sophia) about Man (Anthropos) rather than about God (Theos).

I spent some six months in a Rudolf Steiner community looking after the learning disabled (in which they were totally dedicated). Schools following Steiner's educational theories (Waldorf Schools) are a popular form of alternative education for alternative types who can afford it.

They may not be dogmatic about God, but they sure have strong views on planting your organic carrots in line with the star signs.

[Jackson Richardson]

Pompey posted while I was typing out.

[Dreamwoven]

Theosophy is the theory side of a many-sided philosophy. I never took that route into the wider philosophy. It might be worth considering visiting a Waldorf School or a Camphill Village. This side of theosophy is more practical and associated with the ideas of Rudolf Steiner, ranging from biodynamic agriculture. There is also architecture and anthroposophical nutrition.

Amongst all of this it is probably easiest to visit a Camphill Village and have a look around. They are always looking for co-workers to live in and share the work of a household.

Well this is the way we did it, but it is only one of many.

[Jackson Richardson]

Steiner was an Anthroposophist, not a Theosophist.

[Dreamwoven]

All the major religions have aspects of their world view that are shared or tangent each other. Mohammad Ahmad mentioned Sufi, which is also interesting. Sufi dancing (whirling dervishes). Eurythmy has a parallel in sufi dance.

The main centre for anthroposophy is in Järna south of Stockholm. Well worth visiting. They also have a hospital for care of cancer patients, Vidarkliniken, like so much else in anthroposophy, is non-profit based.

[Mohammad Ahmad]

No, it comes from the Greek theos, which means God, and the Greek sophia, which means wisdom. (Sophia was also a goddess of wisdom). In my opinion, the term should be abandoned because of its cultural associations with Madame Blavatsky, who in turn has become a byword for fashionable occult humbug. But yes, Sufi certainly falls within the realm of mystic wisdom traditions.

Thank you to clarify but also I find its etymology which it is:
sophy
Function: noun combining form
Etymology: French -sophie, from Latin -sophia, from Greek, from sophia wisdom, from sophos
: knowledge : wisdom : science <anthroposophy>
But the Greek is more suggested
Why I think that it comes from Sufi :
I think that because the sound is the same and make sure the word (Sufi) is an Arabic word and has the same sound of English , it is being borrowed to English.

[NikolaiI]

Okay. This topic.

Nope. There shouldn't be contradictions, so I'm shutting it down.

No more theosophy - that is, it's worthless. You're wasting your time on a totally worthless topic by messing with it at all.

What I mean is, there are infinitely better sources of wisdom if you are looking for that, and that message is infinitely sound and true and there's no reason whatsoever, in the entire universe, why you or anyone should ever look up or learn about theosophy.

All of the things you could learn about it are simply an expanded set of the previous few statements.

It's an intense, conflicting, extended set of, "Is he good?" talking about a certain few individuals. It contains many instances of the thought, "Oh, but he's smart."

The details are pointless and useless, but if you want, look it up.



The reason - why? Why would you ever go to a source of "wisdom," or "spiritual knowledge,"

from people who would say such things as

"Judaism is a religion of hate and malice towared everyone and everything outside itself."

That's just insane, and stupid.


If you practice hate-speech, you are guilty of the worst crime you could really ever commit, in my view. Yes, causing harm to others physically is bad, but doing so verbally can be even worse.

Do you understand?

Headache. Sucks. Leave it alone.

Lol.

As for Steiner; okay, he wasn't as bad as Blavatsky, but he would still have to explain away statements such as

No. . um. No. I am not looking more of them up. It's just darkness.



The one I was thinking of was not as bad. . and I started to look for an exact quote and came across..

I will give a few words of it. . .

"Reds and blacks descend from abnormal humans"

I chose not to read any further and I basically, urge you not to either. There is no reason to.

I mean - my commands mean nothing Smile. be at peace. but still, why not?


You want words? you want me to convince you in words? force you to believe?

There is one thought, one idea that had to become accepted enough to let the Holocaust to happen, and that thought was a certain race of people is subhuman.

These people were espousing it in the decades preceding what happened in Nazi Germany. . .

The fact that "Steiner and Hitler were at odds" means nothing when they were both espousing that certain members, groups and ethnicities were not part of the human race.

It doesn't matter what else they say.

You cannot say "We're all one" and "This group is less than human" in the same sentence without condemning yourself entirely.

It's not just silly, or stupid, but it's insane, and stupid, and it's the most dangerous kind of insanity and stupidity, the kind that led to the worst crime against humanity in history.


It's the worst kind of insanity, because it mixes the good with the bad in such a way that is so charismatically appealing that it is in a sense, seductive.

It's the most unique case of an intelligent person saying something insanely dumb, and dangerously wrong.


I hate this topic because it's so useless.. but still, there's like still a group of these people. . .and they're still doing things... and like.. the people who said these things - there's a lot of sites that are in favor of Steiner, and Blavatsky...

isn't that crazy?

I'd say let's all put a stop to this...

I mean is there anyone who disagrees? I really don't get it. . these people are nuts, and bad, and dangerous to the world. . .

They contributed to the one idea that had to become accepted before the atrocities of genocide were enacted - and that wasn't just once, in the early 40's, beginning in Germany, it has happened many times throughout history.

I'm not putting the links up. . I'm not putting the quotes up. . .I will put up the original quote, the one that alerted me to the fact that something is seriously wrong with this picture,

Rudolf Steiner is insane and evil, and anyone telling you otherwise is either directly or indirectly part of a conceived attempt to portray him otherwise.

I'm not putting up the links because, there's just no reason to. If you do the research eventually you'll find out.

Eventually you'll find something like "Jewry has outlived its purpose," amixt a bunch of others that don't quite seem so bad,

and eventually you'll see a page full of the most horrible things said about many groups of people. . .


Okay. I did my duty. I rarely do. You should consider yourself luckier than a man in the desert who stumbles acorss a live, Supreme paradise bird.

As is obvious, I won't come back to this thread and probably won't even visit Lit-net for a short while, if it is being often visited and discussed.


Oh - and as is also obvious, the legitimate sources of wisdom in the world are extremely numerous, and contain many wonderful, brilliant, peaceful, kind and wise teachers who are very sane, patient, skillful at sharing wisdom, etc., etc.

I won't go into any of that here, except to say that.

Okay. Peace. Enjoy.


All I will say - and sure, this is important, and yes, it's in many places, but one place I didn't see it is in any of my research on that topic -

all that matters is what you personally experience, what you learn and discover by yourself.

Where does doubt come into it? Well only in the sense that yes, you have to go through many lifetimes before you get to a glimpse of your true nature... that's all I will say.. Go search, go enjoy, go live, go be happy . . .go to your journey and enjoy and live. :-)

Peace - namaste. . see ya later. Go visit a nature park. Forget about evil but do not forget what it looks like, how to recognize and know what would destroy your soul, and do not ever give up the game of learning how to fight it - that is, peaceably, with words, strength, kindness. ..

One of the most touching, dearest, sweetest moments of my life was Tara Brach describing the childhood of the baby boy who was Hitler. . .the fear.. .all the pain and fear that he lived with during his infancy and all his formative years..

It was the tender, sweet and touching moment that it was because Tara had faced it, felt it, processed it, understood it, and passed the story of compassion along; the touching of life to life, the flow of love and endearment ant peacefulness and bliss and love. And in all of those things, power.

Take care, enjoy, search, be happy, and if you ever want help, or need help of any kind,

may you find it.

Peace, adios. I'm not leaving, just leaving this thread for good. Not interested. Never was. But, like I say, did my duty.

Jackson Spielvogel and David Redles of the Simon Wiesenthal Center's Museum of Tolerance analyze Blavatsky's racial ideas in her book Secret Doctrine. According to Spielvogel and Redles, Blavatsky labeled some races superior and others inferior. They clarify that Blavatsky did not advocate "domination of one race over another" and that she was against violence. They comment that Blavatsky's work "helped to foster antisemitism, which is perhaps one of the reasons her esoteric work was so rapidly accepted in German circles." They state Blavatsky "sharply differentiated Aryan and Jewish religion" and believed "The Aryans were the most spiritual people on earth." They quote Blavatsky's writing in Secret Doctrine as stating Aryans used religion as an "everlasting lodestar" in contrast to Judaism which Blavatsky claimed was based on "mere calculation" while characterizing it as a "religion of hate and malice toward everyone and everything outside itself."

[NikolaiI]

Supreme Paradise Bird. . I am not sure if that is the correct name, I mean the one that is hopping about on the branch with its feathers spread out to indicate a semi-circular pattern, all black except for a flattened, blue "V" shape sort of like a mouth, in its mating ritual . .

but oh, any paradise bird, making the encounter slightly less unlikely.

[YesNo]

Are the Anthroposophists and the Theosophists antisemitical today? This might be something peculiar to their past. Christianity was antisemitical in its past as well.

I usually drive around the Chicago area on Saturday and today decided to stop by the Theosophical Society in Wheaton because of this thread. Although the main building was closed the grounds were open and so was the Quest Book Store. The grounds were well maintained and the book store contained books, statues, crystals and the sort of things you would find in a New Age bookstore. Many religions were represented and they seemed to be non-judgmental about one's religious beliefs.

[Pompey Bum]

Thank you to clarify but also I find its etymology which it is:
sophy
Function: noun combining form
Etymology: French -sophie, from Latin -sophia, from Greek, from sophia wisdom, from sophos
: knowledge : wisdom : science <anthroposophy>
But the Greek is more suggested
Why I think that it comes from Sufi :
I think that because the sound is the same and make sure the word (Sufi) is an Arabic word and has the same sound of English , it is being borrowed to English.

Well, sophia is a very common and well attested Greek word. (It's the same sophia in philosophia, for example). Greek culture had a profound effect on Latin (Roman) culture, and the Latin tongue was a parent of French, which is why you find it in those languages. Arabic is a Semitic language, but Greek is Indo-European, so there isn't going to be a direct connection between sophia and Sufi. In theory, it might have been be a loan word, but I'm pretty sure that Sufi comes from the Arabic word suf (wool) and is a reference to the wool clothing that the Sufi ascetics used to wear. It is perhaps a coincide (or is it an esoteric pattern?) that they are homonyms that both touch wisdom traditions.

Are you are a Sufi, Mohammad? When I was a young man (which I am not now), I traveled to Konya in Turkey and attended a religious service at the famous Dervish Mosque. It was such an energetic service, full of dancing and joy. I have never forgotten how happy those Sufis were to be dancing to God.

I am very pleased to make your acquaintance in any case.

[free]

Thank you all for your replies. I've read something about socalled 'thoughtforms' that are within the teachings of theosophy. The idea of it is very interesting. There are thoughts which can take the life of their own. I think, based on this, there is today's tendency for the world to 'think positive' in order not to let the negative 'thoughtforms' overtake the lead and drive the world towards destruction. Seems very reasonable to me.