The trouble with stream of consciousness...

[tim270]

I think the fundamental flaw of SoC is that it pretends to be something it isn't. SoC is no more "organic" or "spontaneous" than traditional narrative methods. It pretends not to be stylized, but, of course it is; there is no escaping that, and to attempt to, is futile.
That said, "Sound and the Fury" gains a great deal in power through its usage. But, ultimately, the greatest power is that it contrasts the different streams. If the novel utilized only one of the streams, instead of the 4, it wouldn't be nearly as effective. So is it right to say that its power derives from SoC? Or that its power derives from (for lack of a better term) its composition as a cubist composition?
For me it's the latter. But the SoC heightens the contrasts. If all four were told only from a traditional narrative standpoint the contrasts wouldn't be so stark.
It's definitely not my favorite technique. But it has its virtues, and its weaknesses.

[cacian]

By looking at the thread title I would propably just think that stream of consciousness is just a text without punctuations because SoC has no punctuation and without it ,it would not exist.

[Paulclem]

I think the fundamental flaw of SoC is that it pretends to be something it isn't. SoC is no more "organic" or "spontaneous" than traditional narrative methods. It pretends not to be stylized, but, of course it is; there is no escaping that, and to attempt to, is futile.
That said, "Sound and the Fury" gains a great deal in power through its usage. But, ultimately, the greatest power is that it contrasts the different streams. If the novel utilized only one of the streams, instead of the 4, it wouldn't be nearly as effective. So is it right to say that its power derives from SoC? Or that its power derives from (for lack of a better term) its composition as a cubist composition?
For me it's the latter. But the SoC heightens the contrasts. If all four were told only from a traditional narrative standpoint the contrasts wouldn't be so stark.
It's definitely not my favorite technique. But it has its virtues, and its weaknesses.

I think SoC was an important narrative development. It gave us a fresh insider's individual idiosyncratic perspective, rather than that of the omniscient narrator. It does offer a lot of scope given the differences in characters/people's perceptions and internal monologues about it.

The weakness is that it is a crafted fiction with a purpose and could never really mimic the actual SoC of anyone - even the author. It is a useful fiction in itself.

[blazeofglory]

By looking at the thread title I would propably just think that stream of consciousness is just a text without punctuations because SoC has no punctuation and without it ,it would not exist.

In fact I have to agree with you. The stream of consciousness flows so overpoweringly it does not stop anywhere and goes uninhibitedly, candidly, uncaring the path it is treading and cutting the edge, the banks that gave it a shape and a way and it kinda inundates anything it flows through. There is no plot, though there is at times but it has no traditional base and it is as if the very tapestry of the subconscious goes unabatedly and refutably, furiously. I like To the Lighthouse by Virginia. It is so poetic, metaphoric and abstract and it unroofs facts, and gives the reader something uncouth, unromantic, inurbane. So is Ulysses, so drab and pedantically sweeping. If you are an academic, you will have to read if you want to have an academic degree in a university that have the book in the syllabus or if you are a professor of literature you will have to read it since you have to give lectures on this, but if you are an ordinary reader you will distaste it. This is what we call a stream of consciousness idea, kind of garbage spewed out from the mouth of some pedants

[rhas16]

I think SoC was an important narrative development. It gave us a fresh insider's individual idiosyncratic perspective, rather than that of the omniscient narrator. It does offer a lot of scope given the differences in characters/people's perceptions and internal monologues about it.

The weakness is that it is a crafted fiction with a purpose and could never really mimic the actual SoC of anyone - even the author. It is a useful fiction in itself.

This idea of SoC as a crafted fiction is something that I have been wondering about lately. I think about this in relation to films such as Bunuel's "The Phantom of Liberty" or Linklater's "Slacker". Here the scenes are reasonably structured events but the linking of these scenes operates like passing a baton in a relay race, the baton being the scene and the focal character being the runner. Can anyone suggest any literature that operates this way?

In many ways I think this approach deals with some of the weaknesses while still allowing for the strengths mentioned previously of SoC . I do realize that what I am interested in is veering away from SoC but I think these films (and any literature that can be suggested?) are a manifestation of it

[RetsixArp]

...am I right in thinking it works only in short doses? Imagine if the whole of Ulysses was in SoC. ...

Finnegans Wake is! But for a short dose, try Hemingway's Snows of Kilimanjaro. The italic stuff is SoC.

[mona amon]

That's why I never even tried to read Finnegan's Wake, LOL.

[Easter]

Okay.. so.. I finished Tropic of Cancer a few days ago... ultimately I liked it....

There were some parts I found really annoying to get through (mostly the more pronounced SoC stuff), but a lot of the book was in a more readily digestible form of SoC, bordering on structured narrative!

The book itself is so beautifully written (even the kind of annoying SoC bits) that I did want to keep reading, despite my annoyance at times.

In general, I will probably stay away from most overt SoC in the future, but something like Tropic of Cancer had so many other redeeming qualities, that it was worth reading.

[Seasider]

I didn't like Tropic of Cancer. When I read Sexual Politics by Kate Millet, I understood why.

[Paulclem]

George RR Martin has a stream of consciousness element in A Dance with Dragons, where characters thoughts are italicised, whilst their speech appears as text. (RetSixArp reminded me).

It is a limited way of using SoC. butI find this to be an illuminating and an interesting way of writing the double edge of a person's thought and response. It seems to effect a good balance betwen the private /personal and public/political.

[Easter]

George RR Martin has a stream of consciousness element in A Dance with Dragons, where characters thoughts are italicised, whilst their speech appears as text. (RetSixArp reminded me).

It is a limited way of using SoC. butI find this to be an illuminating and an interesting way of writing the double edge of a person's thought and response. It seems to effect a good balance betwen the private /personal and public/political.

That kind of limited SoC doesn't bother me... the extensive kind I found in Tropic of Cancer was a bit off-putting. I definitely think it can be used effectively in small doses, but the larger texts that utilize it just leave me perplexed and annoyed!

[missmeadowsweet]

The most experience I've had with reading SoC is with the works of William Faulkner. I appreciated this writing style in his novels The Sound and the Fury and As I Lay Dying, but the rest of the novels I read (I think like five or six others) were almost unbearable, not so much because they had more SoC, but because the SoC in them was less relatable to the actual story and did not properly represent the emotion of the narrator which added to the overall literal action of the story, which I felt the first two novels did. So I suppose you could say that SoC can add positively to a story if it is used to express feelings or thoughts of a character which could not be expressed so poignantly in any other way. I think SoC can actually be very relatable if it is a used as an expression of a character's thought process, in a thought by thought way, so that the reader is inside the head of the character, so to speak. Most people will have experienced similar thought processes themselves (since our brains all work similarly), so what the character is thinking, feeling, remembering, etc. usually at a time of heightened emotional tension will be relatable. That's what I found with the first two Faulkner novels I read, especially The Sound and the Fury.

[dark desire]

I do think that SoC is certainly quite interesting but I myself find I often have trouble with books written in this format. It can prove difficult to follow. One of the biggest problems I find I have with it, is that it seems that SoC writing, because it does have a certain rambling to it at times, often has the effect of making my own thoughts start to wander. It is as if reading it puts me in a sort of trance like state, and than I end up half-way down the page without a clue as to what I had just read and so I have to go back and do a lot of rereading. It is hard to get my mind to stay focused when reading SoC writing because I find there can something almost hypnotic about it.

Why do you need a clue of what is going on? Try staying in the trance. You don't even have to try that, you just have to let yourself be in that state. The fact that you are achieving it is wonderful. Forget about the story, about the plot, about everything. Just enjoy the trance. I am trying to write SoC these days and I understand that authors just want readers to be there, somewhere. Nothing else. Whatever understanding has to happen, will happen. Just let your conscious mind sink completely.

[Desolation]

Why do you need a clue of what is going on? Try staying in the trance. You don't even have to try that, you just have to let yourself be in that state. The fact that you are achieving it is wonderful. Forget about the story, about the plot, about everything. Just enjoy the trance. I am trying to write SoC these days and I understand that authors just want readers to be there, somewhere. Nothing else. Whatever understanding has to happen, will happen. Just let your conscious mind sink completely.

YES! Exactly.

In my opinion, part of the purpose of stream of consciousness is to induce a certain state of mind in the reader. That trance-like state is part of the writer's goal, even if it can mean sacrificing pieces of the plot.

[Varenne Rodin]

I write in this style, as much as a person can. I've always enjoyed it, and I find that people tend to enjoy reading my work. I like reading SoC when the author is someone I like; someone whose thoughts are interesting, varied and dramatic.

The only complaints I've gotten on my own works are regarding swear words and gore. My inner monologue is full of profanity.