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Thread: Good writers' Achilles's heels and bad writers' redeeming features

  1. #16
    Registered User Rores28's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCamilo View Post
    Borges's prose lacks aesthetic quality and Shakespeare, the loose canon plot builder has no deficiencies?

    Sure, if you would say, Borges dialogues are lacking or his difficulty to product long texts, but what are exactly that he is lacking on aesthetic field except changing spanish language from its baroque style to a fluid and precise prose?
    What do you mean by "loose canon plot builder"?

    Again I can only read Borges in translation, and in translation the aesthetic quality of his prose leaves something to be desired.
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  2. #17
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    In spanish Borges has a beautiful prose.

    "Antes de Nietzsche la inmortalidad personal era una mera equivocación de las esperanzas, un proyecto confuso"

    "Equiparar mujeres a flores es otra eternidad o trivialidad; he aquí algunos ejemplos"

    It has an oral quality of pauses and stylistic precision with analogies and personifications which have a very poetic rendition. He does use some weird orders and unusual words, but he probably spoke like that and asking him to degrade the "quality" of his vocabulary to sound less difficult is a weird kind of critic. I'd argue that it's part of what gives him a certain rhythm in each phrase.
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  3. #18
    Registered User Rores28's Avatar
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    Perhaps I will be able to read Spanish one day.
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rores28 View Post
    What do you mean by "loose canon plot builder"?

    Again I can only read Borges in translation, and in translation the aesthetic quality of his prose leaves something to be desired.
    Shakespeare plots are not so well developed, mostly he created a sittuation and then he didnt need to worry about it because his dialogues would carry the play ahead. It is not one of his strengths (but it didnt need to be, there wont be ever a perfect writer or anything near to that, because every form has its limitations and strengths and this leads to the writers showing it as well).

  5. #20
    Registered User Rores28's Avatar
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    eh agree to disagree
    Check out my blog it has basically nothing to do with literature.
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  6. #21
    Postmodern Geek. TheChilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NiMROD View Post
    Hah I suppose that really is the true Achilles' Heel for Pynchon isn't it? He can definitely be difficult, and after reading V. I think it's made Gravity's Rainbow much easier to tackle for me. The hardest part I think is that as a reader you're trying very hard to ground everything, and Pynchon is purposely not letting you. He actually has a great quote (in V., the exact place escapes me) about how the generations are one seamless fabric, but we look at generations outside our own with a fondness for their peculiarities. Because this fabric is ruffled and full of folds, and no matter if you stand at an apex or trough of this fabric, the whole picture will inevitably be obscured, and thus never understood.

    I think this actually describes his writing pretty well.
    To this day... I still don't know if I'll have the balls to tackle "Mason & Dixon"... I'm guessing I'll probably learn more while trying to fight a massive migraine headache for the next few months.
    "We look at the world, at governments, across the spectrum, some with more freedom, some with less. And we observe that the more repressive the State is, the closer life under it resembles Death. If dying is deliverance into a condition of total non-freedom, then the State tends, in the limit, to Death. The only way to address the problem of the State is with counter-Death, also known as Chemistry." -- Thomas Pynchon, Against the Day

  7. #22
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    Good Writers: Almost all of John Steinbeck's books are painfully mundane with some interesting stuff thrown into the mix. He's still a great writer and my favorite.

    Kurt Vonnegut seems to be a real try-hard. He tends to soapbox frequently throughout his novels (namely Breakfast of Champions). Additionally, his writing style is very juvenile. I don't have a problem with swearing or colloquial language in narrative, but Vonnegut seems to employ it too much. At the end of the day, he seems to be a much better storyteller than a writer.

    A Bad Writer: Chuck Palahniuk's writing style is atrocious. It seems to be exponentially worse than the problems that I listed with Vonnegut's style. Additionally, he doesn't seem to tackle relatively unexplored or unpopular issues, excluding Fight Club to some extent. That said, his characters and plots are very original and they appeal to me personally. That's really the only reason I read his books.

    Come to think of it, Palahinuk isn't even that bad of a writer, when compared to others. I think I just tend to underrate him because his fanboys tend to claim that he is some sort of literary god.

  8. #23
    Registered User Melysnl's Avatar
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    Ayn Rand doesn't trust the readers enough to get the message.



    Quote Originally Posted by My2cents View Post
    As everything he wrote seemed like rough first drafts to me, I was always baffled that Faulkner was so highly regarded. I can see now though how obsessing over form can really delusion even the best of writers as Gustave Flaubert was with Bouvard and Pecuchet.
    I think this is the reason why I don't like Faulkner. Before I could never exactly explain why. His writing is overdone. It comes across like someone who's trying too hard. Maybe better editing would've helped? His popularity baffles me too.
    All good books have one thing in common- they are truer than if they had really happened. (Hemingway)

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheChilly View Post
    To this day... I still don't know if I'll have the balls to tackle "Mason & Dixon"... I'm guessing I'll probably learn more while trying to fight a massive migraine headache for the next few months.
    Ha you and me both. Still taking on Gravity's Rainbow, it takes some careful reading. I tend to drift, not from boredom but Pynchon digresses so much that I start digressing in my head from any idea that interests me. Mason and Dixon IS mocking me from the shelf though.

  10. #25
    Postmodern Geek. TheChilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NiMROD View Post
    Ha you and me both. Still taking on Gravity's Rainbow, it takes some careful reading. I tend to drift, not from boredom but Pynchon digresses so much that I start digressing in my head from any idea that interests me. Mason and Dixon IS mocking me from the shelf though.
    I honestly had more fun with Gravity than I did with "Against the Day", to be honest. Just because the former did a huge number on my mind throughout, and still gave me a reason to keep reading. AtD didn't feel as prophetic, but two out of the novel's various clusters still kept me reading.

    Which is why I now love airships.
    "We look at the world, at governments, across the spectrum, some with more freedom, some with less. And we observe that the more repressive the State is, the closer life under it resembles Death. If dying is deliverance into a condition of total non-freedom, then the State tends, in the limit, to Death. The only way to address the problem of the State is with counter-Death, also known as Chemistry." -- Thomas Pynchon, Against the Day

  11. #26
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    "... For no other reason than they found God" Re-reading this old thread, I found that comment unintentionally funny.

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