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Thread: Good writers' Achilles's heels and bad writers' redeeming features

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    ignoramus et ignorabimus Mr Endon's Avatar
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    Good writers' Achilles's heels and bad writers' redeeming features

    Let's try something different! I want you to think of your one of your favourite writers. Now say something about them that you particularly dislike, or are at odds with, or admit isn't the writer's most outstanding feature.

    It's only fair that I cast the first stone. Beckett's my favourite writer. His early work (More Pricks than Kicks, Murphy and Watt), although I do like Murphy and love Watt, strikes me as being very pedantic at times (and pedantic throughout in the case of Kicks).

    You can also do it the other way around: pick a writer whose whimsical combinations of words make you positively shudder and say something nice about them.

    Me, I remember having hated Elizabeth Bowen's The Heat of the Day with a passion, but I do think the book's underlying allegory provides plenty of food for thought.

    Your turn now!
    I am still alive then. That may come in useful.
    Molloy

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    Registered User My2cents's Avatar
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    As everything he wrote seemed like rough first drafts to me, I was always baffled that Faulkner was so highly regarded. I can see now though how obsessing over form can really delusion even the best of writers as Gustave Flaubert was with Bouvard and Pecuchet.

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    Registered User Chris 73's Avatar
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    George R R Martin. He's capable of some lovely prose but often doesn't bother. Compare his earlier works like Fevre Dreame or his sf short stories to Game of Thrones and you'll see what I mean.

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    Registered User Des Essientes's Avatar
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    The greatest novelist of the 20th Century was Celine (Louis-Ferdinand Destouches), but he was a racist.

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    Registered User Desolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Des Essientes View Post
    The greatest novelist of the 20th Century was Celine (Louis-Ferdinand Destouches), but he was a racist.
    YES! Absolutely. Journey is one of my all-time favorites, but Celine's Nazism makes his later novels very trying. It's a shame, really.

    I'd say that Dostoevsky and Tolstoy were hampered by their stringent Christianity, and their endings usually involving everyone finding God and living happily ever after for no reason other than that they found God.

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    Cool Another greatest writer .... people prone to use superlatives

    usually haven't passed their sophomore year.

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    I really like Thomas Pynchon. His novel V. though uses the word "said" so many times. It's somewhat bizarre. Highly esteemed authors can disregard writing rules all the time, but this particular one (though really more of a guideline or style than a rule) was just aggravating. His later writing doesn't have this problem.

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    Artist and Bibliophile stlukesguild's Avatar
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    Another greatest writer .... people prone to use superlatives
    usually haven't passed their sophomore year.


    Beware of the man with just one book. -Ovid
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    Borges less appealing quality is that he read almost everything there is to read, you have to interrogate his creation process after so much input.

    Quote Originally Posted by Des Essientes View Post
    The greatest novelist of the 20th Century was Celine (Louis-Ferdinand Destouches), but he was a racist.
    I don't think his racist make him any less of a writer though.
    My blog about literature (in spanish): http://otrasbentilaciones.wordpress.com/

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    Postmodern Geek. TheChilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NiMROD View Post
    I really like Thomas Pynchon. His novel V. though uses the word "said" so many times. It's somewhat bizarre. Highly esteemed authors can disregard writing rules all the time, but this particular one (though really more of a guideline or style than a rule) was just aggravating. His later writing doesn't have this problem.
    Agreed, even though for Pynchon, I think his Achilles' Heel is more towards his immense difficulty (... and I found James Joyce easier to read, not counting "Finnegan's Wake", but "Ulysses" isn't that bad for me) and huge reliance on density/complexity over fleshing out characters, which kinda isn't a problem for me because Pynchon is already a master at turning about anything he touches into a world of his own.
    "We look at the world, at governments, across the spectrum, some with more freedom, some with less. And we observe that the more repressive the State is, the closer life under it resembles Death. If dying is deliverance into a condition of total non-freedom, then the State tends, in the limit, to Death. The only way to address the problem of the State is with counter-Death, also known as Chemistry." -- Thomas Pynchon, Against the Day

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheChilly View Post
    Agreed, even though for Pynchon, I think his Achilles' Heel is more towards his immense difficulty (... and I found James Joyce easier to read, not counting "Finnegan's Wake", but "Ulysses" isn't that bad for me) and huge reliance on density/complexity over fleshing out characters, which kinda isn't a problem for me because Pynchon is already a master at turning about anything he touches into a world of his own.
    Hah I suppose that really is the true Achilles' Heel for Pynchon isn't it? He can definitely be difficult, and after reading V. I think it's made Gravity's Rainbow much easier to tackle for me. The hardest part I think is that as a reader you're trying very hard to ground everything, and Pynchon is purposely not letting you. He actually has a great quote (in V., the exact place escapes me) about how the generations are one seamless fabric, but we look at generations outside our own with a fondness for their peculiarities. Because this fabric is ruffled and full of folds, and no matter if you stand at an apex or trough of this fabric, the whole picture will inevitably be obscured, and thus never understood.

    I think this actually describes his writing pretty well.

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    Registered User Des Essientes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desolation View Post
    YES! Absolutely. Journey is one of my all-time favorites, but Celine's Nazism makes his later novels very trying. It's a shame, really.
    Celine wasn't a Nazi, although he went with the Nazis and the Vichy guys when they left France. Celine claimed to be an anarchist and I believe him, but he was really racist in is writing towards almost everyone who wasn't white and French. I really think his later novels are just as good as Journey To The End Of The Night and Death On The Installment Plan. It's almost as if Celine was writing one extremely long novel throughout his life.

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    Registered User Desolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Des Essientes View Post
    Celine wasn't a Nazi, although he went with the Nazis and the Vichy guys when they left France. Celine claimed to be an anarchist and I believe him, but he was really racist in is writing towards almost everyone who wasn't white and French. I really think his later novels are just as good as Journey To The End Of The Night and Death On The Installment Plan. It's almost as if Celine was writing one extremely long novel throughout his life.
    It can hardly be said, though, that his writing spared white Frenchmen. He pretty much raged against EVERYONE...except for cats. White, Black, Hebrew, French, American, German, Christian...he put everyone on the chopping block. The people that he seemed to hate most were the rich, actually.

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    Registered User Rores28's Avatar
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    I love Cormac's prose but sometimes he uses the suffix -wise too much "slantwise" etc.. and the words imagining and reckoning.

    Borges has amazing ideas and formal innovation but his prose (which I've only read in translation) lacks a commensurately impressive aesthetic quality.

    Fiztgerald is amazing stylistically but sometimes heavy-handed metaphorically.

    David Foster Wallace's giddiness with his own linguistic cleverness is so palpable as to be irritating at times.

    Shakespeare may be the only author for whom I can't indentify any deficiencies.
    Check out my blog it has basically nothing to do with literature.
    http://slingsandarrowsandtheproudman.blogspot.com/

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    Borges's prose lacks aesthetic quality and Shakespeare, the loose canon plot builder has no deficiencies?

    Sure, if you would say, Borges dialogues are lacking or his difficulty to product long texts, but what are exactly that he is lacking on aesthetic field except changing spanish language from its baroque style to a fluid and precise prose?

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