Classical Listening

[Emil Miller]

Here she is again with with a American 'classic' that has been a favourite of mine for 40 years or more.

https://youtu.be/MDxKtkkbE7w

[Emil Miller]

Are you a zombie? if you are not moved by this, the answer is yes.

https://youtu.be/wWnWZcTuqW4?list=RDwWnWZcTuqW4

[desiresjab]

Are you a zombie? if you are not moved by this, the answer is yes.

https://youtu.be/wWnWZcTuqW4?list=RDwWnWZcTuqW4

I have to agree with you. That was transcendant.

[desiresjab]

Is Hayden the most prolific of the legendary classical composers? 104 seems a staggering number of symphonies for any individual.

[stlukesguild]

Haydn was incredibly prolific. Beyond his 104 symphonies he composed 13 operas (although only the last few are ever performed and no where near the level of Mozart's efforts), 68 string quartets, 45 piano trios, 123 trios for baryton, viola, and cello, 14 masses, 3 oratorios, and countless other works.

Having said that, J.S. Bach composed nearly 200 cantatas which have survived (scored for a variety of instruments, vocal soloists, and choir). It is thought that many more cantatas have been lost... as much as 1/3 to 1/2 of his actual output. Add to this other church music including his Magnigficat, Mass in B-Minor, 7 Motets (again with many others lost), four Kyrie–Gloria Masses, the Christmas, Easter, and Ascension Oratorios, the St. Matthew and St. John Passions (again with 2 other passions... Mark and Luke lost) to say nothing of his huge output of instrumental work including concertos and sonatas for various groups of instruments as well as works for solo cello, violin, keyboard, and organ.

In touching on the question of which composers were the most prolific you might also consider the more than sizable oeuvres of Mozart and Schubert which were completed in a rather limited span of time, Mozart dying at age 35 and Schubert at age 31.

The award for the largest oeuvre in classical music is usually awarded to Georg Philipp Telemann. He was a friend to both J.S. Bach and G.F. Handel. Telemann's oeuvre oeuvre consists ofmore than 3,000 compositions, half of which have been lost, and many of which have not been performed since the 18th century. Telemann composed 1,043 sacred cantatas and 600 overture-suites (an orchestral composition that was something of a prototype to the symphony... commonly based upon dance structures) as well as a large number of concertos, sonatas, oratorios, chamber music, etc... Telemann was long dismissed/ignored with the thought that all his works sound the same. An criticism also often leveled at Vivaldi's concertos. With the increasing impact of the HIP or Historically Informed Performance movement, many works of Baroque and earlier music have been rediscovered... and given appropriste performances/recordings. This includes Telemann. I have some 20 discs of Telemann's music (although to be honest this is in contrast to the 400+ discs I have of J.S. Bach's music.)

For those interested, the flute concertos performed by Emmanuel Pahud are a good introduction to Telemann:

[stlukesguild]

I would also look into any of Elisabeth Wallfisch' recordings of Telemann's violin concertos:

[desiresjab]

I know that a few works of Teleman have been transcribed for guitar. Regrettably, I think I only read through a couple of them when I was active. Many of the forms you mentioned I do not know the normal length of, except I know dance forms are generally short, concertos and symphonies and operas are long and complex. Masses are long too, I guess. Hayden sounds like the Euler of music with that extraordinary output. Averaged out by the year, however, Herr Mozart probably beats most for output. Bach had rather an ideal environment for composing. For poor Mozart, freedom to compose without incredible stress was rare. Yet he managed to get it out. When you are one of the top three for quality, yes, I guess you managed. Look at Ramanujan. His environment was barely helpful to his interests. Yet that level of genius will often out. Still, I wonder how many great genuises of every sort have gone down the drain of history anonymous because the time was not right and they were in a bad place for invention.

Another interesting question you could probably give a good answer to is: Which first class composer has the smallest repetoire? There is some distinction in making first class on a small output. I do not have a trace of an idea on this one, except for the standard itself. First class means stellar. Gauss's standard of first class in math was that you understand Euler's formula on sight. Man, that is pretty stringent. Which stellar great had the smallest repetoire, and how small was it?

[stlukesguild]

Haydn was one of the great innovators of Western Classical Music. He essentially consolidated the key elements of the symphony and the string quartet... and was a major composer in each genre. Yet the whole of his oeuvre... let alone the whole of his essential works... would not likely outlast that of the whole of Bach or Telemann. Most of his symphonies would last all of 30 minutes or less. We're not yet up to Beethoven's let alone Mahler's sprawling hour plus long symphonic excursions. The orchestral suites or overtures as composed by Telemann and Bach were constructed of a series of dance movements that might add up to half and hour of more:



Cantatas range from 15 or 20 minutes to a half-hour+. Oratorios often last 2 hours or more. Bach's single work for solo keyboard, the Well Tempered Clavier is commonly spread across 4 CDs. Speaking of scale, you might also consider complexity of the music. A two hour opera scored for full orchestra, solo vocalists, and chorus is far more involved than a collection of solo piano sonatas of the same length.

Bach had rather an ideal environment for composing.

I don't know how ideal Bach might have thought his situation was. He had repeated disputes with his employers who struggled to grasp the complexity of his music. He was even jailed by them for a period over such a dispute. He envied composers like Telemann, Handel, and others who had access to top-tier musicians, orchestras, and singers... including female soloists... who were banned by the more Puritanical of Bach's employers. His works were often scored to showcase the one or two outstanding soloists available at a given time.

For poor Mozart, freedom to compose without incredible stress was rare... I wonder how many great genuises of every sort have gone down the drain of history anonymous because the time was not right and they were in a bad place for invention.

Mozart struggled in pandering to an aristocratic audience when the audience was shifting to one more bourgeois or middle class. His Magic Flute was incredibly successful with the audiences in Prague, and he might have done far better had he continued to work for such an audience in Prague... or in London, as Haydn did in his latter days, than to continue to strive for aristocratic patrons in Vienna.

Another interesting question you could probably give a good answer to is: Which first class composer has the smallest repetoire?

Well... the answer there depends upon how you define "first class". Mahler's oeuvre consists of 10 symphonies and a few song cycles and little else worthy of mention. Chopin's entire oeuvre is almost limited to works for solo piano and a few piano concertos. Henri Duparc is known almost exclusively for his 17 mélodies (French Art Songs). Hugo Wolf is also known almost exclusively for his songs (lieder). Then you have Mussorgsky, who due to alcoholism, produced a rather truncated body of music including the Night on Bald Mountain, Pictures at a Exhibition, his single opera, Boris Godunov, and a cycle of songs. I suspect, however, that there are many composers of renown having earned their place in the pantheon based upon a single work: Engelbert Humperdinck's Hansel and Gretel, Paul Dukas' The Sorcerer’s Apprentice, Carl Orff's Carmina Burana, Pietro Mascagni's Cavalleria Rusticana, etc...

[North Star]

Another interesting question you could probably give a good answer to is: Which first class composer has the smallest repetoire? There is some distinction in making first class on a small output. I do not have a trace of an idea on this one, except for the standard itself. First class means stellar. Gauss's standard of first class in math was that you understand Euler's formula on sight. Man, that is pretty stringent. Which stellar great had the smallest repetoire, and how small was it?

Abel Decaux (1869-1943) produced only one work, Clairs de Lune, for piano (1900-1907). It sounds like something written after Schönberg's atonal works and Debussy's solo piano masterpieces, except that it predates both.



Of more well-known composers, I would have to name Ravel, whose opus list is short not least because of his meticulous polishing of every work he published.

[Emil Miller]

Abel Decaux (1869-1943) produced only one work, Clairs de Lune, for piano (1900-1907). It sounds like something written after Schönberg's atonal works and Debussy's solo piano masterpieces, except that it predates both.



Of more well-known composers, I would have to name Ravel, whose opus list is short not least because of his meticulous polishing of every work he published.

The question 'which stellar great' had the smallest output ? would, on this performance of Decaux, preclude 'stellar', however, Ravel must be rated as one of the truly great composers despite, or perhaps because of, his relatively small oeuvre.

[North Star]

I've been deriving great pleasure from these recordings this week. 4 CD's, each recreating a Schubertiade - chamber music concerts with similar programming to the events Schubert held himself, with solo and group songs, piano duets, sonatas and ensemble works mixed together.

[Emil Miller]

Wagner was a revolutionary musical genius but he could only reach such heights because, like Newton, he stood on the shoulders of giants, but my God what greatness.

https://youtu.be/vrd0qTjp2rY

[14ks1855]

If you have not listened to the two cello Concertos by Nino Rota, ..do!

[kiz_paws]

If you have not listened to the two cello Concertos by Nino Rota, ..do!

I prefer his Cello Concert n.2


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIKJzOOsZhY

Beautiful!

Welcome, by the way, to you, 14ks!

[Secret III]

I recently discovered Handel, a German conductor that immigrated to England in the 1700's and wrote many classics. I would like to get more of his music. Good stuff. Very Godly and righteous and loyal to the monarchy.