Are Human Beings Inherently Evil?

[ftil]

I do not think humans are inherently evil and in fact nobody is inherently evil. Evil or good does not come with birth and in the course of our involvement or alliance with the world we live in we have been acquiring these attributes, maybe in our endeavor at adjusting or in our struggle for survival we are changing our behavioral patterns. Certain external conditions necessitate certain types of behavior. Think that you are living in a world of business and if you are too good you cannot make money. Even in your ordinary course of life or in your everyday life when it comes to dealing with your family members or with contemporaries or with rivals your saintliness will push you behind and you have to be a bit of evil as the circumstance demands

I would be very far from making an authoritative statement. In fact, there is still no fully understood the causal factors in psychopathy and antisocial personality. Contemporary research has variously stressed the causal roles of genetic factors, constitutional deficiency, deficiency in aversive emotional arousal, the influence of particular family and environmental patterns, We know separable dimension of psychopathy. The first dimension involves the affective and interpersonal core and reflects traits such as lack of remorse, callousness, selfishness, the exploitative use of others, inflated and arrogant self-appraisal, glib and superficial charm. The second dimension reflects psychopathy involving an antisocial, impulsive, and socially deviant lifestyle.
Traditional psychotherapeutic approaches have not been proven effective in altering psychopatchic and antisocial personalities.

Well, many questions.

[Paulclem]

Can illnesses be classified as evidence of evil?

[ftil]

Can illnesses be classified as evidence of evil?

It is a good question. Can we classify personality disorders such as psychopathy or antisocial as illness? Did Ted Bundy, a serial killer, suffer from a mental illness? He showed the classic psychopathic traits of good looks, charm, and intelligence. But he was also highly manipulative and showed a total lack of remorse for his victims all young women whom he sexually abused and then murdered.

[Paulclem]

There's absolutely no doubt that he, and others have perpetrated acts of terrible evil and were deadly individuals not fit to live in normal sodiety.

Given the totality of humans though, they are extremely unusual luckily. I suspect that they were ill - I don't know what the clinical conclusions were. The question of whether they could be reformed is not one anybody could seriously consider or test given the magnitude of their crimes and the manipulation you pointed out. It would be a huge risk to declare someone reformed or sane after what they had done.

For that reason, it would be impossible to base a conclusion about any kind of inherency upon them, I reckon.

As for the rest of us, it is fair to say that we all have the potential, given certain circumstances, to commit good or evil acts. Having the potential to is different to having an inherent quality though.

[ftil]

There's absolutely no doubt that he, and others have perpetrated acts of terrible evil and were deadly individuals not fit to live in normal sodiety.

Given the totality of humans though, they are extremely unusual luckily. I suspect that they were ill - I don't know what the clinical conclusions were. The question of whether they could be reformed is not one anybody could seriously consider or test given the magnitude of their crimes and the manipulation you pointed out. It would be a huge risk to declare someone reformed or sane after what they had done.

For that reason, it would be impossible to base a conclusion about any kind of inherency upon them, I reckon.

As for the rest of us, it is fair to say that we all have the potential, given certain circumstances, to commit good or evil acts. Having the potential to is different to having an inherent quality though.

Bundy underwent multiple psychiatric examinations and he wasn’t diagnosed with mental illness He was executed in 1989. If we would consider psychopaths and antisocial as having mental illness we would not have prisons at all but mental hospitals.

It is a serious issue that is in the center of attention of many scholars as the prevalence of antisocial personality is estimated to be about 3% for males and 1% for females. There are not epidemiological studies estimating the prevalence of psychopathy.

Well I would strongly argue that we all have the potential to commit murder.

[Paulclem]

It might be that there was a state agenda for him to be executed, or that the psychiatry at the time was unable to find a label to describe him. I think he's unrepresentative of humans, and most people would call him a nutter.

If we would consider psychopaths and antisocial as having mental illness we would not have prisons at all but mental hospitals.

We have both don't we? Psychopaths don't make up a significant portion of society. The kind of people you find in prisons are those with poor education, moderate learning difficulties and drug addicts.

Well I would strongly argue that we all have the potential to commit murder.

I agree. As I said, we all have the potential to commit good and evil, but that doesn't make it inherent.

[ftil]

Paulclem wrote:

It might be that there was a state agenda for him to be executed, or that the psychiatry at the time was unable to find a label to describe him. I think he's unrepresentative of humans, and most people would call him a nutter.

Are you familiar with his case? Well, Bundy confessed to 30 homicides. Was that a state agenda I doubt it considering his crimes. Psychiatry knew at the time of his execution about psychopaths and antisocial personality. As I wrote, he had a multiple psychiatric evaluations.

We have both don't we? Psychopaths don't make up a significant portion of society. The kind of people you find in prisons are those with poor education, moderate learning difficulties and drug addicts.

We don’t have the prevalence for psychopaths. However, research done by Hare in prison setting has shown that 49% received antisocial personality diagnosis whereas 33% received a diagnosis as psychopaths. Secondly, antisocial personality and psychopaths include a mixed group of individuals; unprincipled biasness professionals, high-pressure evangelists, crook politicians, drug pushers, and assorted criminals. It is believed that a large number of psychopathic individuals manage to stay out of correctional institution, although that tend to be in constant conflict with authority.

I would be very far from minimizing the seriousness of the problem. Vast researches speak volume.

[Paulclem]

When I think of psychpath - in my ignorence - I'm thinking of the serial killer type like Bundy. Clearly the term has a wider definition.

— n
Also called: sociopath a person afflicted with a personality disorder characterized by a tendency to commit antisocial and sometimes violent acts and a failure to feel guilt for such acts

From the online dictionary.

So the people you are referring to in the study are somewhat differet from what I was referring to. I think that's ppsychiatry's problem to sort out in terms of labelling because it's clear that the 33% you refer to are not Ted Bundys.

it's interesting that they feel no remorse/ compassion,but what is unclear is whether this can be inculcated in a person with this disorder.

Anyway, it still does not mean that we can judge the human state by what is a minority of individuals with disorders or conditions.

[ftil]

So the people you are referring to in the study are somewhat differet from what I was referring to. I think that's ppsychiatry's problem to sort out in terms of labelling because it's clear that the 33% you refer to are not Ted Bundys.

Well, psychiatry has a list of specific traits based on which the diagnosis is made. They don’t need to be a serious killers to be diagnosed as a psychopath.

it's interesting that they feel no remorse/ compassion,but what is unclear is whether this can be inculcated in a person with this disorder.

It is the most puzzling piece and it is not fully understood. I am not satisfied with research regarding the causal roles of deficiency in aversive emotional arousal or constitutional deficiency. The researchers haven’t found the explanation for those deficiencies, yet. We only know that the psychotherapeutic approaches are not effective. According to Charney, factors inherent in the psychopaths personality- the inability to trust, to feel as others do, and to learn form experience- apparently make the progress for psychotherapy very poor.

I have been asking what went wrong with those people that they don’t feel as others do. I have explored alternative fields but I am not satisfied, either. Of course, there is no scientific confirmation of alterantive explanations and I don’t think scientists would ever be interested in looking there.

Anyway, it still does not mean that we can judge the human state by what is a minority of individuals with disorders or conditions.

I would be very far from comparing the majority of people to psychopaths or antisocial. But we can’t deny the seriousness of the problem, either.

[Paulclem]

Yes. Fascinating and disturbing.

[IceM]

I recant my previous statements. Yes, humans are naturally evil. The Bible teaches that all have sinned and all fall short of the glory of God. We are totally depraved. However, we can find freedom from sin and forgiveness of sin in Christ Jesus if we place our faith in Him as Lord and Savior and repent of our sins.