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Thread: Death of old values: ethical, societal and economic beliefs

  1. #1
    Haribol Acharya blazeofglory's Avatar
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    Death of old values: ethical, societal and economic beliefs

    Today this earth has been the worst place to live in; for this epoch has seen bigger unsolvable problems than any other in the past. Division based on castes, creeds, nationalities, religious ideologies, economic and social conditions have outdistanced humans.

    I sometimes mulling over some unaddressed or take for granted problems feel that what values we revere and think useful and inevitable are born of human follies as a matter of fact. Of course we have distanced ourselves from brutal life styles, but the brutality and viciousness in man has not been lessened at all over centuries. We are as, maybe more, as cruel on one another as our savage ancestors. Today we keep on stocking things and we have a very strong weapon. In the past people have arsenals to fight with their enemies; and today indeed our money or wealth has taken that place. The mighty and powerful keep on stacking wealth, and it is easier and has no problems of storage.

    Ancients used their muscle powers to rule over their subjects, and today strengths, powers have been redefined, and your money is a more powerful weapon than any other arsenals.

    Money rules, and plays a central role across all sections of people in society. The more one can hoard it the more secure he will be financially, socially and nationally.

    I dream of a moment in which there will not be bigger chasms between humans. I do not choose a completely classless social structure that is possible only in theory.

    But all that moved was our laws and of course laws were framed not by democrats, but by a few bureaucrats who make laws that are very conducive to themselves. For, these rulers or lawmakers may have large acres of land and they make if their laws and constitutions benefits them. Today if we see closely our socioeconomic situations what we see are people who build houses live in roofless places, and those who cultivate our lands have nothing to eat tonight. And weavers wear half-tattered clothes.

    Food is the most basic need and the majority who grow food-cereals are starved and those who lazily live have lost of foods to waste. These wastrels squander huge sums of money meaninglessly.

    The purpose of this post is to validate the fact that flaws exist in our values, and these values need to be questioned and we do not seem to take care of them. We need to look at them from a different perspective and check whether there are better values than what we hold in fact? All that I feel is this earth is common wealth and all equally deserve. Let us not forget that only slyness helped us to hoard.

    “Those who seek to satisfy the mind of man by hampering it with ceremonies and music and affecting charity and devotion have lost their original nature””

    “If water derives lucidity from stillness, how much more the faculties of the mind! The mind of the sage, being in repose, becomes the mirror of the universe, the speculum of all creation.

  2. #2
    Orwellian The Atheist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blazeofglory View Post
    Today this earth has been the worst place to live in; for this epoch has seen bigger unsolvable problems than any other in the past. Division based on castes, creeds, nationalities, religious ideologies, economic and social conditions have outdistanced humans.
    Sorry, but I don't get this at all - are you sure we're on the same planet?

    I constantly tell my kids that they're the luckiest people who ever lived. Life expectancy has increased dramatically this century, and even the poorest nations have a lower percentage underfed than at any time in the past. Religious wars are mostly ancient history, wars reached a peak in WWII and have involved far fewer people than ever before since then. Social divisions are a fraction of what they were, and racism has been in decline for half a century.

    I really think you have it all back to front.
    Go to work, get married, have some kids, pay your taxes, pay your bills, watch your tv, follow fashion, act normal, obey the law and repeat after me: "I am free."

    Anon

  3. #3
    Registered User billl's Avatar
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    I think theAtheist has a good point here, there are lots of good things to point to. However, I think that there is more than enough room for some controversy regarding the lingering effects of colonialism on Africa. Exploitative practices that, in some places, led to the death of 50% of the population at the time have yet to be corrected, so I think it'd be hard to argue for sure that things are better everywhere than they were 100 or 200 years ago. I'm not an expert or anything, but I've heard this angle (that things were once better than today) argued before, and cursory research doesn't do much to contradict it. They're having trouble getting the old sustainable habits back, and still dealing with soil depleted by years of cotton production, for example. And I think that, in some of the countries that are having the most trouble (to put it lightly), the biggest problem is government corruption. It seems like, in the colonial days, working for the government was often a way to win advantage at the expense of one's countrymen, and the practice sometimes continued right through the transition to independence.

    Well, after all of that typing on the negative side (because I want to be careful with theAtheist on the case), I do want to restate my general agreement with his optimism and his reading of the current trends (world hunger has decreased since the 70's), as well as my admiration for depth of compassion that's characteristic of BlazeOfGlory's writings here.
    Last edited by billl; 06-16-2009 at 10:33 PM.

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    Bibliophile JBI's Avatar
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    Honestly, the greatest thing hurting today is the reference or reluctance to let go of the past. In a sense, the screw ups of our parents are still showing in today's generation - we get better, but ultimately, there are those whose screw ups take a long time to correct themselves. For instance, how long did it take for racism to die in the so called "West"? Trick question. Is that because of today's society, or yesterday's though?

    There were times when life expectancy was somewhere in the 20s (usually less for women) and people lived like barbarians. There were times where the pursuits of the wealthy led to mass slaughter and death (The Irish Potato Famine comes to mind first, but essentially almost any war you can think of usually fits the bill). If anything we are getting better, however slowly.

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    Vincit Qui Se Vincit Virgil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
    Sorry, but I don't get this at all - are you sure we're on the same planet?

    I constantly tell my kids that they're the luckiest people who ever lived. Life expectancy has increased dramatically this century, and even the poorest nations have a lower percentage underfed than at any time in the past. Religious wars are mostly ancient history, wars reached a peak in WWII and have involved far fewer people than ever before since then. Social divisions are a fraction of what they were, and racism has been in decline for half a century.

    I really think you have it all back to front.
    Hear hear!! We really do see the world quite similarly. Now if I can only work that atheism out of you.
    LET THERE BE LIGHT

    "Love follows knowledge." – St. Catherine of Siena

    My literature blog: http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/

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    Serious business Taliesin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
    Sorry, but I don't get this at all - are you sure we're on the same planet?

    I constantly tell my kids that they're the luckiest people who ever lived. Life expectancy has increased dramatically this century, and even the poorest nations have a lower percentage underfed than at any time in the past. Religious wars are mostly ancient history, wars reached a peak in WWII and have involved far fewer people than ever before since then. Social divisions are a fraction of what they were, and racism has been in decline for half a century.

    I really think you have it all back to front.
    Is your real name Fukuyama, by any chance?

    Mind you, I agree that life nowadays is good for a very large percentage of people, compared to other ages but I wouldn't be very sure that there won't be some sort of a major conflict in the future.
    If you believe even a half of this post, you are severely mistaken.

  7. #7
    somewhere else Helga's Avatar
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    there are many great things in this world and luckily most people have a pretty good life. but there is still so much wrong with this world, humans do have a pretty decent life but at what cost, everyday a new specie is in danger mainly because of greed. we desperately need the fur of a white tiger or the skin of a snake and we cut down forests and we are constantly making more room for ourselves and don't care about the other animals that habitat this same earth.

    Also ( and now I'm mainly referring to my country) the economy is having a terrible affect on the people here, I can honestly say that everybody know one or two people that have lost their homes. this is affecting kids because there is an increasing number of kids that know their parents can't afford to put food on the table, in many homes both parents have lost their jobs and are living on welfare. all this because a few men were greedy and the government didn't do anything about it.
    I hope death is joyful, and I hope I'll never return -Frida Khalo

    If I seem insensitive to what you are going through, understand it's the way I am- Mr. Spock

    Personally, I think that the unique and supreme delight lies in the certainty of doing 'evil'–and men and women know from birth that all pleasure lies in evil. - Baudelaire

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    Orwellian The Atheist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virgil View Post
    Hear hear!! We really do see the world quite similarly. Now if I can only work that atheism out of you.
    Haha! People have been trying for 30-odd years without success.

    Quote Originally Posted by Taliesin View Post
    Is your real name Fukuyama, by any chance?
    No; I'm on the opposite side of the fence to him.

    Quote Originally Posted by Taliesin View Post
    Mind you, I agree that life nowadays is good for a very large percentage of people, compared to other ages but I wouldn't be very sure that there won't be some sort of a major conflict in the future.
    Me neither.

    Quote Originally Posted by Helga View Post
    Also ( and now I'm mainly referring to my country) the economy is having a terrible affect on the people here, I can honestly say that everybody know one or two people that have lost their homes. this is affecting kids because there is an increasing number of kids that know their parents can't afford to put food on the table, in many homes both parents have lost their jobs and are living on welfare. all this because a few men were greedy and the government didn't do anything about it.
    Where do you live? It seems at odds with what I know of the world economy.
    Go to work, get married, have some kids, pay your taxes, pay your bills, watch your tv, follow fashion, act normal, obey the law and repeat after me: "I am free."

    Anon

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    Quote Originally Posted by JBI View Post
    Honestly, the greatest thing hurting today is the reference or reluctance to let go of the past. In a sense, the screw ups of our parents are still showing in today's generation - we get better, but ultimately, there are those whose screw ups take a long time to correct themselves. For instance, how long did it take for racism to die in the so called "West"? Trick question. Is that because of today's society, or yesterday's though?

    There were times when life expectancy was somewhere in the 20s (usually less for women) and people lived like barbarians. There were times where the pursuits of the wealthy led to mass slaughter and death (The Irish Potato Famine comes to mind first, but essentially almost any war you can think of usually fits the bill). If anything we are getting better, however slowly.
    Seconding JBI.

  10. #10
    Don't worry, Be Happy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taliesin View Post
    Is your real name Fukuyama, by any chance?

    Mind you, I agree that life nowadays is good for a very large percentage of people, compared to other ages but I wouldn't be very sure that there won't be some sort of a major conflict in the future.
    I think you have made a very relevant point. I especially feel concerned about global warming and the resulting climatic changes we have started seeing in the world.
    If left uncontrolled, it is going to affect clearly very soon how we live, and our ethical, scoeital and economical values.

  11. #11
    somewhere else Helga's Avatar
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    Atheist,
    I live in Iceland, here companies and homes are going bankrupt and they say the unemployment agency wont be able to continue their work in the fall because they don't have enough money for all the people that are out of a job. I will mention that many people are still doing OK, me included, but taxes are going up and the food is getting more and more expensive, I get depressed just thinking about it. But I am one of the luckier ones who don't need to worry, yet. people I work with have been struggling for a while loosing family businesses and not being able to continue with their kids sport or music lessons. Schools are trying to have hot meals always at lunch at a small price so kids get at least one hot meal a day. but these are the worst cases.
    I hope death is joyful, and I hope I'll never return -Frida Khalo

    If I seem insensitive to what you are going through, understand it's the way I am- Mr. Spock

    Personally, I think that the unique and supreme delight lies in the certainty of doing 'evil'–and men and women know from birth that all pleasure lies in evil. - Baudelaire

  12. #12
    Orwellian The Atheist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helga View Post
    Atheist,
    I live in Iceland, here companies and homes are going bankrupt and they say the unemployment agency wont be able to continue their work in the fall because they don't have enough money for all the people that are out of a job. I will mention that many people are still doing OK, me included, but taxes are going up and the food is getting more and more expensive, I get depressed just thinking about it. But I am one of the luckier ones who don't need to worry, yet. people I work with have been struggling for a while loosing family businesses and not being able to continue with their kids sport or music lessons. Schools are trying to have hot meals always at lunch at a small price so kids get at least one hot meal a day. but these are the worst cases.
    Now I see.

    Iceland is a special case, because your banks were silly enough to invest most of their capital into junk bonds backed by NINJA* loans in USA. The problem's been made worse by Iceland having a tiny economy and few manufacturers.

    Unfortunately, it's going to take you some years to recover, but it will happen.

    *NINJA - No income, no job or assets.
    Go to work, get married, have some kids, pay your taxes, pay your bills, watch your tv, follow fashion, act normal, obey the law and repeat after me: "I am free."

    Anon

  13. #13
    Ataraxia bazarov's Avatar
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    Moral crisis caused economic and all other crisis. Poor or rich - man will be happy if his soul and mind are peaceful. If it's not, then all wealth of this world won't be enough for him.
    At thunder and tempest, At the world's coldheartedness,
    During times of heavy loss And when you're sad
    The greatest art on earth Is to seem uncomplicatedly gay.

    To get things clear, they have to firstly be very unclear. But if you get them too quickly, you probably got them wrong.
    If you need me urgent, send me a PM

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