Dark Fences

[shortstoryfan]

I am rather frightened of posting this because it is my first piece I have put on this site. It came out in a moment, so if it just seems crazy tell me. I think it has a message, but I'm not really sure...I kind of feel that it came through me rather than from me, which has only happened once before.


I have seen what lies across the dark fence.
A dividing line that seperates minds,
not even love could conquer it.
Neighboring houses, unfenced enclaves,
stand against the outer world, surrounded,
and I have seen what lies across that invisible fence.

Do I dare cross that darkness now?
Is the face of a fellow man so unfamiliar?

I have seen what lies across the dark fence.
A dividing border, a separate horde,
our similarities could not overcome this.
Neighboring countries, unfenced things,
without real bounds, surrounded,
and I have seen what lies across that invisible fence.

[malcolmx]

good idea but( sorry to say ) but explain it little bit clear.

[TheFifthElement]

Ah, don't be afraid shortstoryfan, we're all writers here, finding a path and figuring it out. In my experience there's no hyper-criticism here!

Anyway, I think your poem has a good concept. I like the idea of the 'dark fence' and I think it can represent a number of things depending on the individual. One of the great things about poetry is how it can evoke different meanings for different people, how it draws on individual experience and makes people feel something, though that something may be something different to what the poet intended! So you're definitely on the right lines. Don't give up!

As to the poem itself, I think it has some strong points, and it could be even stronger with a little careful editing. I'm probably one of those annoying nit-picking type people so a couple of things stood out for me as being a little inconsistent/confusing. For example:

I have seen what lies across the dark fence.
A dividing line that seperates minds,
not even love could conquer it.
Neighboring houses, unfenced enclaves,

fenced or unfenced? Maybe that was your intent but I had to think about it, is there a reason the enclaves are unfenced? Are they unfenced but within a broader fence? This distracted me from the poetry. That being said, I'm easily distracted

stand against the outer world, surrounded,
and I have seen what lies across that invisible fence.

invisible or dark? I think the repetition of dark here might be very effective. I think the reader could probably take the leap that it's not really a real fence. More a figurative fence.

I think similar comments apply to the final stanza.

But there is, as I said, a lot of merit in this poem. It has a good rhythm, an interesting, developable theme. I liked these lines particularly:

I have seen what lies across the dark fence.
A dividing line that seperates minds,
not even love could conquer it.

A dividing border, a separate horde,
our similarities could not overcome this.

And I think it's important to say that no one can tell you how to write your poem. Take or dismiss these comments as you see fit, it is, in the end, only an opinion. Hopefully a few more people will comment, though it has been a bit slow on the poetry section of late, and then you'll get a clearer picture of what seems to work and what doesn't, and you can tweak or not tweak in your own way and as you think is best.

Hope that helps some. I'd be very interested to see some more of your poetry.

[shortstoryfan]

Hahaha. Well, I understand how this poem can be confusing and maybe I should think more from the readers point of view. I really don't know how to edit very well at all, at least not my own work, but hopefully this forum will help me look at my work more clearly. Maybe it needs a stronger idea, but I think I get too caught up in word sounds to ever make a very strong idea or image.

Maybe the two neighboring houses are fenced against the rest of the world? All I know is, I liked the different sounds of unfenced and enclave. So, I was like, that sounds nice, let's do that. Hahaha. I think if people look at the rest of the poem, they can see how driven it is by sound. I actually must commend you, FifthElement, because after to reading your poems I decided I had the courage to use internal rhyme. I used to be so scared of rhyme, and sometimes I have to be reminded that it is a good thing to use it.

The image of the "dark fence" comes from the dark rail fences I've seen on the horse farms around here all my life. I always thought they looked very fashionable and frightening. Maybe the dark fence is an actual fence, but the invisible one is an imaginary fence, the reason that the dark fence was put up in the first place.

I really can't say what this poem is about since I feel that the better ones do usually come through me in a quick moment. The first stanza is a personal fence. I kind of think the first stanza recalls the two neighboring houses of Capulet and Montague, but I could be overstepping the intent of the creative force that sent this poem to me.

The second stanza is supposed to be kind of a visual fence, that I'm certain of...

The last stanza is like a fence we all see, a fence of the entire world. Not a personal thing, but you know, things like racism and war, dividing things like that.

I also wonder if the dark fence is supposed to represent you know, a dark period of history, or a blemish upon our moral character, or even, you know, how in most countries darker skinned people are discriminated against.

I'm not sure about any of this, but I am certain that I appreciate the comments and can easily see how editing this would have created a clearer idea...reading published poets seems confusing to me, especially contemporary ones, so I don't know, maybe I am taking too much liberty.

[TheFifthElement]

Hahaha. Well, I understand how this poem can be confusing and maybe I should think more from the readers point of view. I really don't know how to edit very well at all, at least not my own work, but hopefully this forum will help me look at my work more clearly. Maybe it needs a stronger idea, but I think I get too caught up in word sounds to ever make a very strong idea or image.

Oh yes, I understand this. I too struggle with editing. I think your idea is strong already.

Maybe the two neighboring houses are fenced against the rest of the world? All I know is, I liked the different sounds of unfenced and enclave. So, I was like, that sounds nice, let's do that. Hahaha. I think if people look at the rest of the poem, they can see how driven it is by sound.

Oh I agree, the two sounds work nicely together. I think that this could work well within the poem, perhaps opposing the 'fence'. Yes, I can see that the poem is sound driven, which is good, there's nothing wrong with that at all. Have you ever read anything by Christopher Middleton? Christopher Middleton is known for his sound over image driven poetry, see here: http://www.poetryfoundation.org/arch...html?id=181974

I actually must commend you, FifthElement, because after to reading your poems I decided I had the courage to use internal rhyme. I used to be so scared of rhyme, and sometimes I have to be reminded that it is a good thing to use it.

That's really nice I had a similar experience when I read the poetry of Mark Strand (thanks to firefangled and Sweets America) - check this out: http://www.poetryfoundation.org/arch...html?id=181380

I'm not sure about any of this, but I am certain that I appreciate the comments and can easily see how editing this would have created a clearer idea...reading published poets seems confusing to me, especially contemporary ones, so I don't know, maybe I am taking too much liberty.

You know, ask 1000 poets and they would say something very similar to what you've said here. I'd say the same. I think poetry is a strange journey, it is a path with no clear route, sometimes it is shade by bushes and trees, sometimes it is very exposed, sometimes there are big rocks in the way and torrential rivers that seem impossible to pass. But we all find our way, even though we might do it in a slightly different way. Take as much liberty as you need, by doing so you will find something that works really well for you.

And I hope that doesn't sound too 'teachery'! Your poem really intrigued me, which is half the battle. The rest is just window dressing - is one window better than another? That's just a matter of opinion. Which is why I am a little cautious, and others will be too, because there is no right or wrong about it.

[Delta40]

I didn't read any of the post replies because I didn't want to be influenced by other people's interpretation. I am not a critic but it struck me that the poem referred to the fences of humankind. That you question whether you have the courage to cross the boundaries that exist between us to find a common ground.

I am a very simple minded person. This is my impression. Your poem is tentative and powerful

Thank you

[shortstoryfan]

Thanks again for more comments, FifthElement. I must say that the poems you have posted seemed less ridiculous than the few I've read, since I don't ever read poetry.

I feel like I must clarify one point: contemporary poetry doesn't only confuse me. I'm not even sure I've liked the poems I have read. Maybe I am not reading the right poets, but the poems I've read make me question whether what I am writing is old fashioned and I just don't realize it. They seem to be without many of the poetic devices used in older poetry. They don't really seem to have a point. The words aren't even pretty. Is this some new direction poetry is taking, where what is written doesn't sound that great spoken? I'm lost on this one.

[blp]

I think being a little worried that you're going nuts is a good feeling for a poet to have about a poem. I also don't think your poem sounds old fashioned. It's true that it's not perfect and it could be clearer, but it's got a certain something odd and interesting, especially the repetition.

I find a lot of contemporary poetry pretty bad too and I don't think I'm in any way a reactionary who just thinks the old ways are the best. Two possible explanations: one is, it may really be that poetry now is in a sort of state of crisis for various reasons; the other is, it hasn't been subjected to the filter of history yet.

[TheFifthElement]

blp makes a lot of good points (he generally does )

I think you have to read a lot of contemporary poetry to find the good stuff. Plus, what you find 'good' poetry is, to some extent, going to depend on what you expect to get out of it. The thing is, none of us really have the time to do that filtering. I started reading contemporary poetry by means of a good Bloodaxe anthology and then picked out certain ones and worked from there. And recommendations. You might want to check out this thread: http://www.online-literature.com/for...ad.php?t=33147 which gives a bit of a flavour.

If you like poets who use beautiful language, you might like Jean Sprackland: http://www.jeansprackland.com/poetry/index.php

[shortstoryfan]

Well, I have read mainly three kinds of poetry.

1.) That which aims for beautiful language, constructive technique, etc.
2.) That which illuminates something.
3.) That which I don't understand at all and don't know what it means, but all the literary journals say it is great, so I wonder, "Why don't I get this?"

This post kind of sounds like a poem to me, and I don't know why.

[blp]

blp makes a lot of good points (he generally does )

*beaming* Aw, thanks.

I went through that contemporary poetry thread of quasi's. I realise the thing that bugs the **** out of me about most contemporary poetry is that it's so elegant, tasteful and civilised. Not that I'm some two-fisted, down and dirty Bukowski type, but whatever I am, I'm not that stuff. I loathe it. It makes me feel like wrecking things.