View Poll Results: Evolution vs. Creation

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  • Creation

    169 40.43%
  • Evolution

    210 50.24%
  • Don't know what to think

    17 4.07%
  • None of the above

    22 5.26%
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Thread: Evolution vs. Creation

  1. #181
    Eccentric Rodent Dyrwen's Avatar
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    Bag of dirt. No contest.

    Pascal's Wager isn't effective, realize that or just stop talking.

    I don't need a god in my life, whereas using your argument, I would only need a god in an after-life, which may or may not exist. Until you can make a decent reason to believe in a god, while I'm alive, you'll continue to meet resistance over the idea you're presenting. Work on that though, really.

    By the way, if you could cite some of that "evidence" presented by creationists that contradicts evolution, I'm sure we'd all find it useful in believing your idea presented, again.
    Last edited by Dyrwen; 04-08-2005 at 07:48 AM.
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  2. #182
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    For you my friend there is no argument that would persuade you. Your mind is made up. The bible calls this state the state of the walking dead. So enjoy your existance, until you do die. Then when you are in front of the living God, you can tell Him that he doesn't exist.

  3. #183
    Eccentric Rodent Dyrwen's Avatar
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    Least you're willing to admit, by mere suggestion, that your mind is made up as well. So I can respect our mutual disagreement, heh. Better not to be persuaded by the mere mouths of men, than face the consequences of an alternate god in the end. Or as a more appropriate wordsmith would say it:

    "Question with boldness even the existence of a god; because if there be one he must approve of the homage of reason more than that of blindfolded fear." - Thomas Jefferson, 1787
    To think is to blog is to distract is to stop is to destroy is to die is to think therefore I am not good enough

  4. #184
    dancing before the storms baddad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dyrwen
    Or as a more appropriate wordsmith would say it:

    "Question with boldness even the existence of a god; because if there be one he must approve of the homage of reason more than that of blindfolded fear." - Thomas Jefferson, 1787
    ...IMHO...
    Hear, hear! No god could show disfavour towards rational thinking. Organized religions' approach seems to be an appeal to emotion, and not an appeal to human kinds ability to think for themselves. Religious groups prefer to indoctrinate people early in life, the younger the better if the brainwashing is to take a strong hold and last a lifetime. Fear is used as the stick, and an everlasting life of happiness at some undefined point in the future is the carrot. The last thing any church wishes its parishinners to do is think for themselves. What they really want is for you to hand over your free will to them because it is obvious by their reasoning that people cannot be trusted to think for themselves. If there is a God, he would probably be dismayed, at least, with the tactics and irreverent partisan approaches taken by organized religions.

    qO978: So spiritual belief (according to one of YOUR posts) is a matter of profitability? And the notion of profitability is tied to either faith (God exists) or scientific fact? I do believe in choosing whatever perspective makes one's life the easiest, as long as it injures no others. But to ignore truth (we ARE of the earth, chemicals, gasses, etc) as so many religions advocate seems to me to be exactly the trouble with organized religion; "ignore truth, believe us".
    I think I'll advocate for truth and fact. But hey, that's just me.....

  5. #185
    Memories of Nuremburg... Miss Darcy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baddad
    I think I'll advocate for truth and fact. But hey, that's just me.....
    *Vehemently* It is not just you, you've got pretty much every atheist in the world behind you...

    I'm afraid there's so much proof against God that there is absolutely no reason to believe in him. Or her. But I don't think most Christians call God a her...simply for the reason that Christianity is ruthlessly sexist, giving no rights to women...that is, Christianity in its wholeness is merely faith in a book, and therefore we should consider all in this book to be adhered to.

    And as to "evidence" for creationism...I'd be extremely interested to hear it. So please don't hold me in suspense for too long. You know what I mean by evidence...logical, credible stuff, not mythology of any kind...though I do love mythology...I digress. And I don't want "miracles", either, because any that have happened in actuality have been merely natural phenomena.

    Darcy

    P.S. Well, Sub, I've got a great idea. If I change my mind about God, I'll get back to you in 65 years to tell you how and why. Though I must admit anything can happen, I am even more willing to admit I see absolutely no chance of that happening. And even if it did, I'd only have to read a paragraph or so of Dawkins, or Hawking, or Gribbin, or anyone like that, and I'd easily slip back into atheism with a sigh of relief.
    Last edited by Miss Darcy; 04-09-2005 at 04:33 AM.


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  6. #186
    Right in the happy button IWilKikU's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by q0987
    For you my friend there is no argument that would persuade you. Your mind is made up. The bible calls this state the state of the walking dead. So enjoy your existance, until you do die. Then when you are in front of the living God, you can tell Him that he doesn't exist.
    Well, not everyone on this forum is uh... 'walking dead'. I was born and raised Christian and have just... 'converted' to atheism. My mind is far from made up and I still search Christianity, Buhddism, non-religious ethics, etc... for direction in how to live my life, and I gotta say, Dyr and AP make a helluva lot more sense to me than Mr. 'I don't want to argue with the walking dead'. Way to spread the Good news q0987!!! Keep us new atheists away from your silly church.
    ...Also baby duck hat would be good for parties.

  7. #187
    Pièce de Résistance Scheherazade's Avatar
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    Please let's remember to keep the discussions -especially those which relate to sensitive issues such as religion- within the Forum rules and respect each other's views even though we do not agree with them.
    ~
    "It is not that I am mad; it is only that my head is different from yours.”
    ~


  8. #188
    Right in the happy button IWilKikU's Avatar
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    sorry :ashamed:
    ...Also baby duck hat would be good for parties.

  9. #189
    precious... subterranean's Avatar
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    Well I think q0987's statement is no better..So no need to feel sorry Kik


    "there are people in the world so hungry that God can not appear to them except in the form of bread"

    Mahatma Gandhi

  10. #190
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    Could you give the scriptural reference for this please. I don't recall reading this before.

    Quote Originally Posted by q0987
    For you my friend there is no argument that would persuade you. Your mind is made up. The bible calls this state the state of the walking dead. So enjoy your existance, until you do die. Then when you are in front of the living God, you can tell Him that he doesn't exist.

  11. #191
    The Yodfather Stanislaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baddad
    ...IMHO...
    Hear, hear! No god could show disfavour towards rational thinking. Organized religions' approach seems to be an appeal to emotion, and not an appeal to human kinds ability to think for themselves. Religious groups prefer to indoctrinate people early in life, the younger the better if the brainwashing is to take a strong hold and last a lifetime. Fear is used as the stick, and an everlasting life of happiness at some undefined point in the future is the carrot. The last thing any church wishes its parishinners to do is think for themselves. What they really want is for you to hand over your free will to them because it is obvious by their reasoning that people cannot be trusted to think for themselves. If there is a God, he would probably be dismayed, at least, with the tactics and irreverent partisan approaches taken by organized religions.
    Well, er, ahem... Organized religion isn't about brain washing, it is about worshiping God, and learning of his will for people on Earth. It is not about indoctrination, it is about belief and faith. One doesn't call there home an indoctrination facility, so why should a simple structure that houses the concecrated body of christ an indoctrination facility???

    And athiesism has it's "carrots" aswell. A life wher one may do whatever they please because there is no eternal consequance.

    You know what I mean by evidence...logical, credible stuff, not mythology of any kind...though I do love mythology...I digress. And I don't want "miracles", either, because any that have happened in actuality have been merely natural phenomena.
    well you see there is no concrete proof, THAT IS WHY IT IS CALLED FAITH. And mmiracles have happened, infact there are quitew a few, there are the biblical miracles, there are the stigmata miracles, there is the miracle at Guadalupe! So just stating that there are no miracles is tripe, I would like to see your proof that no miracles have occured!

    qO978: So spiritual belief (according to one of YOUR posts) is a matter of profitability? And the notion of profitability is tied to either faith (God exists) or scientific fact? I do believe in choosing whatever perspective makes one's life the easiest, as long as it injures no others. But to ignore truth (we ARE of the earth, chemicals, gasses, etc) as so many religions advocate seems to me to be exactly the trouble with organized religion; "ignore truth, believe us".
    Organized religion does not preach to ignore facts, and the bibal states that man is made of the earth, read Genisis for that'ne.
    And it is not ignore truth believe us, it is ignore heracy believe God.

    ---------------
    Stanislaw Lem
    1921 - 2006, Rest In Peace.
    "Faith is, at one and the same time, absolutely necessary and altogether impossible"

  12. #192
    unidentified hit record blp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislaw
    Well, er, ahem... Organized religion isn't about brain washing, it is about worshiping God, and learning of his will for people on Earth. It is not about indoctrination, it is about belief and faith. One doesn't call there home an indoctrination facility, so why should a simple structure that houses the concecrated body of christ an indoctrination facility???
    Wow. You sound a bit brainwashed. Actually, a lot of people do think of the home as a brainwashing facility and see it as the task of becoming an adult to liberate themselves from the received ideas passed on to them by their parents. One of which might be religious belief.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislaw
    And athiesism has it's "carrots" aswell. A life wher one may do whatever they please because there is no eternal consequance.
    Sorry, but this is just nonsense. Every action has a consequence - although the idea of heaven is a fantasy of a place where there aren't any and the idea of being forgiven all your sins and going there is a fantasy of the consequences here on earth ultimately not mattering.



    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislaw
    well you see there is no concrete proof, THAT IS WHY IT IS CALLED FAITH. And mmiracles have happened, infact there are quitew a few, there are the biblical miracles, there are the stigmata miracles, there is the miracle at Guadalupe! So just stating that there are no miracles is tripe, I would like to see your proof that no miracles have occured!
    Yes. This is why these arguments are so pointless - because the religionists deny the basic terms of argumentation from the outset, stating that through their faith, their going to continue to believe no matter what arguments the rest of us offer. Their faith apparently doesn't extend to faith in the idea of logical argument. And yet they continue to argue.
    You immediately jump from stating that proof doesn't matter to giving proof. This obstinate clinging to something that doesn't make sense is making you incoherent, or preserving your incoherence.

  13. #193
    precious... subterranean's Avatar
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    How can you be so sure?

    Quote Originally Posted by Miss Darcy
    *Vehemently* It is not P.S. Well, Sub, I've got a great idea. If I change my mind about God, I'll get back to you in 65 years to tell you how and why. Though I must admit anything can happen, I am even more willing to admit I see absolutely no chance of that happening. And even if it did, I'd only have to read a paragraph or so of Dawkins, or Hawking, or Gribbin, or anyone like that, and I'd easily slip back into atheism with a sigh of relief.


    "there are people in the world so hungry that God can not appear to them except in the form of bread"

    Mahatma Gandhi

  14. #194
    precious... subterranean's Avatar
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    Just a silly question:

    Did the ancient man have the same body structure as today's man? I mean did he have same, for example, digestion system, neuron system, blood circulation system, etc???


    "there are people in the world so hungry that God can not appear to them except in the form of bread"

    Mahatma Gandhi

  15. #195
    Eccentric Rodent Dyrwen's Avatar
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    Ancient man, in terms of <10k years ago did have basically the same structure biologically and mentally. They just weren't exposed to the same amount of information to become as full brained, pardon the term, as we have. For the most part, mammals hold the same organs, and only differ depending on diet. Like how hyenas can digest hooves, human teeth are built for omnivorous eating, I'd imagine apes have a certain resistence to certain potencies of citrus depending on their fruit intake.
    To think is to blog is to distract is to stop is to destroy is to die is to think therefore I am not good enough

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