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Thread: Freedom Doesn't Exist.

  1. #46
    Something's Gone hoope's Avatar
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    Many people try to conect or link between the determinism and free will ..infact mostly philosophers do that.
    But i think that they don't meet ..
    The existence of free will has always been there .... and human being is responsible for his acts .. Determinism can not be versus to the free will
    But the actual opposite to free will is the fatalism , here the will is uneffectual.
    "He is asleep. Though his mettle was sorely tried,
    He lived, and when he lost his angel, died.
    It happened calmly, on its own,
    The way the night comes when day is done."



  2. #47
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    Forgive me for checking and speaking up, but you are still very young and at a very intense age at this time.... 'this too shall change'.

    Kurt Gödel's Incompleteness Theorem
    Makes you think eh?

    In life we should learn to challenge our own perceptions dont you think?

    Try this, you wont regret... I love it, you will too.

    OM
    Every vibration has a corresponding sound and everything in the universe has a vibration and thus a sound. Each atom, molecule, cell, object, group of objects, even the entire universe, has its own collection of vibrations and unique sound.

    When you chant a mantra, you merge with the sound vibration and become at one with the energy wavelength of the object of your mantra. Mantra chanting makes you at one with everyone, everywhere who is chanting that mantra and with everyone who has ever chanted the mantra. All the saints who have ever reached enlightenment through the technique of chanting that mantra connect with you as you connect with the vibration of the mantra. You merge with their essence which has been purified and is holy and you become pure and holy because that divine level of existence vibrates only with holiness, peace, and bliss.

    By chanting a mantra, your cells, molecules, atoms, and sub-atomic particles all vibrate in the same wavelength as the mantra. Once attuned with this vibration you connect with everything resonating on that plane of existence. It’s like tuning a radio. At first you may get static, but once you are in the right frequency your reception is perfect. Om is the universal sound. It is within every word and within everything. So when you chant Om, you merge with all energy and all forms, from the sub-atomic to the universal, from the most gross to the most divine. And when you are tuned in perfectly, you will receive holy frequencies clearly and merge and emerge at one with the source of all and live happily ever after.

    Many meditation teachers suggest that it is necessary to understand every intellectual aspect of the meaning of the mantra that is being practiced, but just as many others feel that the intellect may tend to confuse and hold back spiritual progress. What both types of teachers agree on is that mantras have the potential to take practitioners to the level of consciousness that transcends the limitations of the mind by a billion-fold. There is an ancient tale that very well shows that true devotion and complete absorption are the key:

    Once upon a time in a land far away lived a poor uneducated, mentally challenged man who tended a herd of cows for his master. He happened upon a meditation teacher and was very taken with his calm, loving, gentle and happy nature. He decided he wanted to know that experience first hand. And so he went to the teacher and begged him to teach him a way to achieve the inner peace that radiated so obviously from the teacher. The teacher accepted him as his student but quickly found that the man couldn’t understand any of the philosophical points he was making and as a matter of fact couldn’t even remember the mantra Om when he tried to teach it to him. The teacher lovingly said, "My oh my, you don’t seem to know anything at all, can’t be taught, and can’t remember anything. You are devoted and sincere in your desire to gain happiness though, so I will try to help you. My son, what do you know?" The man said, "Oh great teacher, the only thing I know is cows. All my life I’ve spent caring for cows, making sure they graze, are milked, and are kept clean. Yes, for me, everything is cows." "Well, that’s alright," said the teacher, "then you know what sound the cows make." "Oh yes," said the man, "they say moo." "Very well then," said the teacher, "for you, moo will be your mantra. All you have to do is say moo continually and you will reach freedom from suffering and know real bliss." So the man chanted moo, moo, moo when he took the cows out to graze and he chanted moo, moo, moo when he milked them, and he chanted moo, moo, moo when he cleaned them. He chanted moo all the time and very soon merged with that vibration, which is Om backward, and reached the highest heights of joyous understanding and lived happily ever after.

    From this story, we learn that it is virtually impossible to chant Om "wrong". It is, after all, an insentient sound. But the giver of this sound to the universe knows the intention and devotion of the practitioner and that is by what we will be rewarded. It is said that one minute of sincere chanting is superior to a thousand hours of mere sounding of the words. A parrot can be taught to recite a mantra but this will be just mere vibrations in the air. It is the love and worship behind the sound that counts. Technically though, there is a "correct" way to chant Om. It is made up of three letters: A, U, M. These contain all the sounds there are. The A is guttural and comes from the throat. It is pronounced without any part of the tongue or palate in contact. The U sound comes from the middle of the sounding board, the palate. In Sanskrit, the A and U join together to become O. The O sound is vibrated from the navel/ solar plexus area and sent up to the sternum to the voice region, the lips, where the M sound is prolonged and vibrated up to the crown of the head. This vibrating M is felt in every cell of the body and is beamed out lovingly, soothingly, powerfully, to everything, everyone, everywhere. Intellectually and metaphysically, A stands for the physical world perceptible to the senses, the material world. U represents the astral and dream planes, heaven and hell. M is the unknown, deep sleep, and that which is unfathomable to the intellect. Thus Om contains the entire spectrum of sound, words, worlds, and concepts. Om represents the source of all light, love, and wisdom.

    There are three ways to do mantras - aloud, silently but while mouthing or humming the mantra, and completely silently within oneself. When done aloud and particularly when done with others, the sound of Om is energizing, calming, and healing. Although it is often encouraged to do your mantra all the time, it would certainly be questionable to consider chanting Om aloud in the middle of a board meeting. Similarly, it may be preferable to do Om silently just by moving your lips if you are in a movie theater. Chanting Om completely silently is considered the most potent method because it is not dependent on having a human voice box, or lips, or facial muscles, all of which are temporary manifestations compared to the billions of years you will be fully at one with Om. It is advantageous to spiritual development to consider the theological, philosophical and mystical aspects of Om while chanting with your physical eyes closed, looking through the third eye, and paying attention to your breath. This may seem complex and complicated, but once in synch, it happens naturally as Om reveals itself, your Real Self, to you.
    'this too shall change'


    I was amazed at how long I could hold the sound but I found it is more potent to think it silently on my daily walk, it makes me feel lighter, like almost stoned.
    Last edited by dizzydoll; 03-20-2010 at 05:49 PM.

  3. #48
    mordacious mendicant Shatov's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoope View Post
    Many people try to conect or link between the determinism and free will ..infact mostly philosophers do that.
    But i think that they don't meet ..
    The existence of free will has always been there .... and human being is responsible for his acts .. Determinism can not be versus to the free will
    But the actual opposite to free will is the fatalism , here the will is uneffectual.
    It looks like we're on the same page here. =)

  4. #49
    Something's Gone hoope's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shatov View Post
    It looks like we're on the same page here. =)
    No one said we weren't !
    "He is asleep. Though his mettle was sorely tried,
    He lived, and when he lost his angel, died.
    It happened calmly, on its own,
    The way the night comes when day is done."



  5. #50
    mordacious mendicant Shatov's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoope View Post
    No one said we weren't !
    No one said we were!

  6. #51
    Jethro BienvenuJDC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dizzydoll View Post
    I was amazed at how long I could hold the sound but I found it is more potent to think it silently on my daily walk, it makes me feel lighter, like almost stoned.
    I read a portion of your quote....

    Les Miserables,
    Volume 1, Fifth Book, Chapter 3
    Remember this, my friends: there are no such things as bad plants or bad men. There are only bad cultivators.

  7. #52
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    I read a portion of your quote....
    each to their own cuz, how would you know if you havent tried it yet?

  8. #53
    My mind's in rags breathtest's Avatar
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    freedom is internal, i think. For some people it exists, and for others it doesn't
    'For sale: baby shoes, never worn'. Hemingway

  9. #54
    Asa Nisi Masa mayneverhave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by breathtest View Post
    freedom is internal, i think. For some people it exists, and for others it doesn't
    Elaborate on this?

  10. #55
    Pirate! Katy North's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by breathtest View Post
    freedom is internal, i think. For some people it exists, and for others it doesn't
    That is an interesting perspective, and I would like to hear more.
    Hope is that thing with feathers that perches in the soul and sings the tune without the words and never stops... at all. ~Emily Dickinson

    I ask not for a lighter burden, but for broader shoulders. ~Jewish Proverb

  11. #56
    Jethro BienvenuJDC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dizzydoll View Post
    each to their own cuz, how would you know if you havent tried it yet?
    I don't have to try drugs to know that they will destroy my body. One can reason through things in order to know....experimentation is not always necessary.
    Les Miserables,
    Volume 1, Fifth Book, Chapter 3
    Remember this, my friends: there are no such things as bad plants or bad men. There are only bad cultivators.

  12. #57
    ésprit de l’escalier DanielBenoit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BienvenuJDC View Post
    I don't have to try drugs to know that they will destroy my body. One can reason through things in order to know....experimentation is not always necessary.
    That's because most of us have been given information on drugs. What information do you have about other religions in order to just completely disregard them?

    As far as free will goes: I'm willing to take a linguistic approach to this matter and state that most of our philosophical concepts of the Western tradition, including the concept of free will, are constructs of our language. This can be seen in Eastern cultures and religions like Buddhism in which neither there is no conception of either free will or determinism. In the case of determinism, take the Chinese language which possesses no tenses and is only able to imply temporality through the use of temporal adverbs. As a result, one of the prime distinctions between Chinese and Western thought was their senses of causality.
    The Moments of Dominion
    That happen on the Soul
    And leave it with a Discontent
    Too exquisite — to tell —
    -Emily Dickinson
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVW8GCnr9-I
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckGIvr6WVw4

  13. #58
    Jethro BienvenuJDC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanielBenoit View Post
    That's because most of us have been given information on drugs. What information do you have about other religions in order to just completely disregard them?

    As far as free will goes: I'm willing to take a linguistic approach to this matter and state that most of our philosophical concepts of the Western tradition, including the concept of free will, are constructs of our language. This can be seen in Eastern cultures and religions like Buddhism in which neither there is no conception of either free will or determinism. In the case of determinism, take the Chinese language which possesses no tenses and is only able to imply temporality through the use of temporal adverbs. As a result, one of the prime distinctions between Chinese and Western thought was their senses of causality.
    You assume too much about my knowledge of other religions. For being so young, you assume that I know nothing?
    Les Miserables,
    Volume 1, Fifth Book, Chapter 3
    Remember this, my friends: there are no such things as bad plants or bad men. There are only bad cultivators.

  14. #59
    ésprit de l’escalier DanielBenoit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BienvenuJDC View Post
    You assume too much about my knowledge of other religions. For being so young, you assume that I know nothing?
    I never said that you know nothing about other religions. That said, I would like to see your objections to what dizzydoll said which led you to calling it "bs".

    I don't mind your objections to it, but to outright call it "bs" seems a bit wanting of explanation, especially coming from someone who does not like others insulting his religion (an understandable sentiment).
    Last edited by DanielBenoit; 03-21-2010 at 12:49 AM.
    The Moments of Dominion
    That happen on the Soul
    And leave it with a Discontent
    Too exquisite — to tell —
    -Emily Dickinson
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVW8GCnr9-I
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckGIvr6WVw4

  15. #60
    Jethro BienvenuJDC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanielBenoit View Post
    I never said that you know nothing about other religions. That said, I would like to see your objections to what dizzydoll said which led you to calling it "bs".

    I don't mind your objections to it, but to outright call it "bs" seems a bit wanting of explanation, especially coming from someone who does not like others insulting his religion (an understandable sentiment).
    hmm....that is NOT what you just said....

    That's because most of us have been given information on drugs. What information do you have about other religions in order to just completely disregard them?
    But....until there is some 'religious' substantiation given for it, I cannot really address the foundations which were never presented.
    Les Miserables,
    Volume 1, Fifth Book, Chapter 3
    Remember this, my friends: there are no such things as bad plants or bad men. There are only bad cultivators.

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