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Thread: A Very Brief History of Religions

  1. #1

    A Very Brief History of Religions

    Someone has written to me with an interesting question regarding
    Hinduism and Buddhism.

    Question: For some reason I always assumed Buddism and Hinduism
    were closely related, they didn't have a "God" per se, just an idea of
    nirvana.

    My answer:

    Hinduism came first. Buddhism breaking away from Hinduism was
    like the Protestant Reformation of Martin Luther breaking away from
    Rome in the 16th. century.

    Actually, one might say that the Vedas came first (Rig, Sam, Yajur,
    Artha) in the Sanskrit language. Then, somehow, a break occured
    and the people who were to evolve into the Zoroastrians drifted away,
    using many words similar to the Vedic Sanskrit terms, (e.g. Soma
    becomes Haoma). This break was possibly between 3,000 B.C.E. and
    2,000 B.C.E. Fire was central to both the Vedic and Zoroastrian
    worship, but there were differences.

    Buddhism split off from Hinduism circa 600 B.C.E.

    Once will notice that the Vedas and Hinduism have anonymous
    prophets and sages and seers. In Abrahamic religions, one dominant and charismatic prophetic personality emerges. It is, I suspect, the nature of a protestant type of split for there to be some charismatic famous individual, such as a Zoroaster or a Siddharth Gautama (Buddha) or Jesus or Muhammed.


    The Zoroastrians are characterized by monotheism and a strong
    duality between good and evil, God and satan. Hinduism is
    polytheistic with no strong sense of dualism/struggle between good
    and evil. Buddhism, in contrast to the other two, was a kind of ethical
    atheism, though atheism is not the proper word, for the existence of
    gods were not denied, but a god was seen as subject to the same
    woes as humanity under the same principles of karma, and worship of
    a god was not seen as a means to deliverance or salvation.

    In a sense, from Zoroastrianism evolved the Abrahamic religions of
    Judiasm, Christianity and finally Islam. The Zoroastrian religion was
    the official religion of Persia/Babylon at the time of the Babylonian
    captivity of the Jewish people. The Old Testament highly praises one
    of the Zoroastrian kings, Darius, as "the beloved of God" because he aided the Jewish people.

    Nirvana or "Nibbana" (in Pali dialect) simply means "to extinguish" like
    a candle.

    The most powerful contrast between Christianity and Buddhism is to
    compare one particular statement of Buddha with one particular
    statement of Jesus.

    Buddha said "I have discovered the architect of this house (the
    human body) which is a house on fire (with the suffering of desires),
    and now that I have discovered the architect/builder (i.e. the causes
    of the cycle of rebirth), this house shall be rebuilt no more (i.e. I shall
    escape the cycle of rebirth and suffering and enter into nirvana or
    extinguishment).

    Jesus said "I come to give you life, and life more abundently. In my
    Father's house are many mansions. If it were not so I would have told
    you. I go there to prepare a place for you."

    So, you see, Buddha is a deconstructor and Jesus is a builder
    (carpenter).

    One may see a curious religious tolerance in common in
    Zoroastrianism, Hinduism and Buddhism, while the Abrahamic religions
    are a mirror image opposite of intolerance for other beliefs. Jewish
    scriptures say "The gods of the nations are demons." St. Paul speaks
    of false prophets, false teachers, and Lucifer as an angel of light who
    may assume the appearance of Christ, but a false Christ or anti-Christ.
    The Qu'ran says, in one of its final Surahs (The Surah of the Unbeliever
    or Kafir) "Say therefore unto the unbelievers, The god which you
    worship is not the God which we worship, and the God which we
    worship is not the god which you worship, so therefore unto you your
    god and unto us our God."

    The Zoroastrian-Hindu-Buddhist religions say things like "Truth is one
    but called by many names." How interesting that new age attitudes came first, historically.
    Last edited by Sitaram; 01-27-2005 at 02:45 PM. Reason: Corrections

  2. #2
    Peace is this way Jester's Avatar
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    i agree, just wanted to add that I believe Zarusthra (spelling???) lived around 1500 BCE... I did research on it a while back.... Of the abrahamic religions the newest one, Bahai are very tolerant towards other religions as well...
    "It all comes down to what we make of ourselves, eh?"
    -The Fairy Godmother

    "Sing on, poor souls! The night is short, and the morning will part you forever!"
    - Uncle Tom's Cabin

  3. #3
    Bear in mind that Ba'hai arose in Iran, in an atmosphere of extreme persecution from orthodox Muslims.

    The World Almanac cites a worldwide population of 6 million Ba'hai. I think I remember that they are not permitted to proselytize, but I must double check on that point.

    One may compare them with the Sufi movements, especially the Mevlevi order founded by Jallaludin Rumi (again, I must double check).

  4. #4
    fated loafer
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    I have a friend who is bahai but I don't really understand what it is. You said it was a "new" religion Jester? Perhaps Sitaram, should this be in your realm of knowledge, you could enlighten me as to the particulars of this religion?

  5. #5

    Bahá'í 101

    Off the top of my head, as I am having coffee this morning, I can tell you from memory that the Baha Ullah, the founder, was in Iran. His title (perhaps Baab, but Im not certain) means "gate."

    Now, this notion of someone being a new prophet is in direct violation of the Qu'ranic statement that Muhammad is the LAST messenger and that there shall be no other. Ba'hai was persecuted in Iran by the orthodox Muslims.


    Of course, if you go to google.com, which is what I always do (or some other search engine) you will find all sorts of things about Bahá'í. I shall post what good links I find later on this morning.

    Wouldn't you just know it! Nowadays, every religion has its own official website!

    http://www.bahai.com/Bahaullah/principles.htm

    Main Principles:

    • The oneness of mankind.

    • Universal peace upheld by a world government.

    • Independent investigation of truth.

    • The common foundation of all religions.

    • The essential harmony of science and religion.

    • Equality of men and women.

    • Elimination of prejudice of all kinds.

    • Universal compulsory education.

    • A spiritual solution to the economic problem.

    • A universal auxiliary language.



    I am looking at "Universal COMPULSORY education" and thinking that education is only truly successeful for an individual when they begin to embrace it as lifelong VOLUNTARY self-education. But certainly our earliest education must start out as compulsory.

    We all know how modern-day students are forced to become "test smart." They must get a high score on things like S.A.T. and G.R.E. so they pay for books and classes to STUDY THE TEST QUESTIONS.

    Well, the point I am about to make is that founders of religions are forced to become "test smart" as history progresses. Someone founding a religion in the 19th or 20th century, a "prophet" or "guru" let us say, already knows that they MUST address certain key issues (like the list above). Twentieth century religion founders know they must have a web site.

    The Prophet Muhammed in the 7th century is an example of someone who was already becoming "test smart." The Qu'ran explicity states that Allah has CHOSEN the language of Arabic and the religion of Islam for the Arab people. Perhaps one might call this the beginning of postmodernism. Religious texts such as Genesis make no mention of some particular language or even religion. In fact, in Genesis, early on in Genesis, there is a verse which simply says "It was then that men began to call upon the name of the Lord." One must dig and conjecture and interpret the Torah to find ancient answers to modern problems. For many centuries, orthodox Jews have observed the mitzvah (commandment) of "shatness" not to mix wool and linen in the same garment. Before they will wear a new coat, they take it to a rabbi who specialized in testing for wool and linen. But the same verse in the Torah which forbids wool and linen also forbids MIXING different breeds of animals. One may see in the verse something which pertains to the new science of genetic engineering, which may be a Pandora's box from which one day shall leap some monster other than hope. And if that day ever does happen, there will be no "putting the monster back in the box." Try putting cell phones and internet and nuclear weapons "back in the box."

    Ancient primordial religions evolve as an oral tradition, with anonymous authors, and a kind of Jungian mythopoiesis at work, and are redacted into some finished final form only centuries later. Less ancient religions have one personality who is not anonymous (e.g. Buddha Siddhartha Gautama), but still it is only 400 years after Gautama's death that the oral teaching is redacted into its final written form, by a council. But with the even more modern religion of Islam, Muhammad is dictating surahs which are written down on the spot (more or less).

    If someone founds a new religion tomorrow, they will have a website with blogs and cams and we will be able to see videos of their prophecy and hear sound-bytes.
    Last edited by Sitaram; 01-28-2005 at 08:20 AM. Reason: Additions

  6. #6
    in a blue moon amuse's Avatar
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    *Zarathustra
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    the air and water have been here a long time, and they are telling stories.

  7. #7
    fated loafer
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    "Universal peace upheld by a world government."

    We'd all like universal peace, but the world governemnt seems neither plausible and a bit more like some kind of overseeing dictatorship.

    It's an intersting religion, in order to make a new religion then, it must be one compatible with recent technological developments in order to spread itself thorughout the peoples?

  8. #8
    Peace is this way Jester's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simon
    You said it was a "new" religion Jester?
    I meant, (did i say new?) that its emerged only in the last a hundred and sixty years I beleive and is reletivly young compared to other world religions and it is considered a worl religion since it is not located in a single nation, also another definition is that it welcomes new poeple rather than excluding them unless they are married, as Zorastrians are doing.
    "It all comes down to what we make of ourselves, eh?"
    -The Fairy Godmother

    "Sing on, poor souls! The night is short, and the morning will part you forever!"
    - Uncle Tom's Cabin

  9. #9
    L'artiste est morte crisaor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sitaram
    Someone has written to me with an interesting question
    Question: For some reason I always assumed Buddism and Hinduism
    were closely related, they didn't have a "God" per se, just an idea of
    nirvana.
    Hinduism doesn't have any gods?? Excuse me?
    What about Brahma, Shiva, Ganesh, and tons of others?
    This person didn't knew much in the first place, if you ask me.
    Ningún hombre llega a ser lo que es por lo que escribe, sino por lo que lee.
    - Jorge Luis Borges

  10. #10
    There is no such thing as a foolish question, since if it is a question for the person who asks (if they sincerely do not know) then it is a legitimate question.
    Last edited by Sitaram; 01-29-2005 at 02:41 PM.

  11. #11
    yes, that's me, your friendly Moderator 💚 Logos's Avatar
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    Please don't cause me to edit/delete posts with ad hominem argument.
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  12. #12
    L'artiste est morte crisaor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sitaram
    There is no such thing as a foolish question, since if it is a question for the person who asks (if they sincerely do not know) then it is a legitimate question.
    Agreed. But I don't think my previous statement contradicted this idea.
    Ningún hombre llega a ser lo que es por lo que escribe, sino por lo que lee.
    - Jorge Luis Borges

  13. #13
    yes, that's me, your friendly Moderator 💚 Logos's Avatar
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    Thank you.

    "Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." Kahlil Gibran
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    Oh Logos, you ruined the party ..nah Kidding...

    Since we're talking about history of religions here, how bout a brief look of Animism or Dynamism (sp?!)..I'm reffering to the religions of the cave men...

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    yes, that's me, your friendly Moderator 💚 Logos's Avatar
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    I know you're always kidding subterranean

    I was thanking someone for graciously editing their own post.


    Quote Originally Posted by subterranean
    Oh Logos, you ruined the party ..nah Kidding...

    Since we're talking about history of religions here, how bout a brief look of Animism or Dynamism (sp?!)..I'm reffering to the religions of the cave men...
    Last edited by Logos; 01-30-2005 at 08:26 PM.
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