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Thread: Room 101.

  1. #16
    Ataraxia bazarov's Avatar
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    Strange way of showing love, like child abuse by weird parents...
    At thunder and tempest, At the world's coldheartedness,
    During times of heavy loss And when you're sad
    The greatest art on earth Is to seem uncomplicatedly gay.

    To get things clear, they have to firstly be very unclear. But if you get them too quickly, you probably got them wrong.
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  2. #17
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    Do you think Big Brother and the Party were watching Winston his whole life?? Was he born just to be caught in a plot the party planned? I was curious about if the party started to watch him 7 years ago, or if they, for some reason, started to plan what would happen when he was born. Did they "map" out his life for him? Thank you!

  3. #18
    Ataraxia bazarov's Avatar
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    No, they didn't.
    If they had control over him from day he was born, they would probably make him better for Party, not a possible threat.
    Why would they map his life? To caught him? Why?
    It would make sense if they wanted to show him as an example to others, but they cured him and let him go; nobody never found out that he was in Room 101 or that he had doubt in Big Brother. Only he, Julia ( they are both too ashamed so they will be quiet) and O'Brien know that, and it will stay like that.
    At thunder and tempest, At the world's coldheartedness,
    During times of heavy loss And when you're sad
    The greatest art on earth Is to seem uncomplicatedly gay.

    To get things clear, they have to firstly be very unclear. But if you get them too quickly, you probably got them wrong.
    If you need me urgent, send me a PM

  4. #19
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    Smile Being shot?

    I was curious. When someone commits a crime against Big Brother, they are brought to the ministry of love and Room 101 to basically torture them into loving big brother. If they take all that time to make the person love big brother, why do they just shoot them after. Winston says once you go to the ministry of love, you are never seen again. Why would the make them love big brother if they just kill them shortly after. And if O'Brien was captured and tortured, why didnt they kill him?
    It has been said,
    That the Body is a Slave to the Mind.
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  5. #20
    Orwellian The Atheist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CABelieve View Post
    I was curious. When someone commits a crime against Big Brother, they are brought to the ministry of love and Room 101 to basically torture them into loving big brother. If they take all that time to make the person love big brother, why do they just shoot them after.
    I've just said this elsewhere!



    It's not "torturing to make them love BB", it's brainwashing of a degree we've never seen, Winston loves BB.

    The reason it matters is for perfection of the Party. The Party is everything, and it's important to ensure perfection at all times. The only way that can be achieved is by having no dissent at all.


    Quote Originally Posted by CABelieve View Post
    Winston says once you go to the ministry of love, you are never seen again. Why would the make them love big brother if they just kill them shortly after. And if O'Brien was captured and tortured, why didnt they kill him?[/FONT]
    O'Brien was speaking metaphorically - he is a member of the Inner Party, and therefore part of the mechanism of BB.
    Go to work, get married, have some kids, pay your taxes, pay your bills, watch your tv, follow fashion, act normal, obey the law and repeat after me: "I am free."

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  6. #21
    Machiavellian. Enjoi.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
    I've just said this elsewhere!

    .
    I saw that!

    Quote Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
    It's not "torturing to make them love BB", it's brainwashing of a degree we've never seen, Winston loves BB.

    The reason it matters is for perfection of the Party. The Party is everything, and it's important to ensure perfection at all times. The only way that can be achieved is by having no dissent at all.
    Completely agree, just as Orwell said in the book, the Party doesn't want any single rebellious thought to live on. They want the people to believe everything about Big Brother and love Big Brother before they die. It is complete and total submission. This is what makes the Party live on.
    Last edited by Enjoi.; 12-04-2008 at 09:33 AM. Reason: Fixing Multi quote =)
    The wish to acquire more is admittedly a very natural and common thing; and when men succeed in this they are always praised rather than condemned. But when they lack the ability to do so and yet want to acquire more at all costs, they deserve condemnation for their mistakes.

    -Machiavelli

  7. #22
    Registered User Stargazer86's Avatar
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    Winston is in a cell with other prisoners when he is first caught, but they never mention him going back to the group cell once he's gone further into his punishment and eventually into Room 101. That being said, how would ANY of the prisioners know what Room 101 was much less be able to have a fear of it? If, from the time they are put into Room 101, to the time they are "cured", they have no outside contact, why on earth would that one man in the prison cell have been screaming and so horrified, specifically mentioning Room 101? ANyone who had been there and come out would by then be so brainwashed, they would never denounce anything Big Brother or the Ministry of Love does, ergo, preventing any outsiders from knowing about it. This whole scene confused me a bit...

  8. #23
    the beloved: Gladys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
    It's not "torturing to make them love BB", it's brainwashing of a degree we've never seen, Winston loves BB.
    Rather, they love Big Brother through torturing "of a degree we've never seen".

    Fear of physical and psychological torture ultimately breaks Julia and Winston. Were they not broken, the torture would continue unabated. The threat of rats and gang rate persists to the end in the minds of the two victims; and probably at a conscious level.

    Oceania is brutality unlimited.

  9. #24
    Orwellian The Atheist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stargazer86 View Post
    Winston is in a cell with other prisoners when he is first caught, but they never mention him going back to the group cell once he's gone further into his punishment and eventually into Room 101. That being said, how would ANY of the prisioners know what Room 101 was much less be able to have a fear of it? If, from the time they are put into Room 101, to the time they are "cured", they have no outside contact, why on earth would that one man in the prison cell have been screaming and so horrified, specifically mentioning Room 101? ANyone who had been there and come out would by then be so brainwashed, they would never denounce anything Big Brother or the Ministry of Love does, ergo, preventing any outsiders from knowing about it. This whole scene confused me a bit...
    Good question, and you're absolutely right, Outer Party members just wouldn't know of Room 101's existence.

    The bloke was a plant from the Thought Police. You build Room 101 up as the worst thing imaginable, then it is! The ultimate horror.
    Go to work, get married, have some kids, pay your taxes, pay your bills, watch your tv, follow fashion, act normal, obey the law and repeat after me: "I am free."

    Anon

  10. #25
    Registered User Stargazer86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
    Good question, and you're absolutely right, Outer Party members just wouldn't know of Room 101's existence.

    The bloke was a plant from the Thought Police. You build Room 101 up as the worst thing imaginable, then it is! The ultimate horror.

    Ah...that makes much more sense. That really puzzled me when I was reading it. Thanks

  11. #26
    BadWoolf JuniperWoolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TiGGeR LoVeR View Post
    I am in serious need of help!!!

    I have an essay due in less than 16 hrs & my assignment is to

    "write an essay in which i explain how the a character in the novel 1984

    could be viewed as morally ambigious and why his moral ambiguity is

    significant to the work as a whole."


    in the essay i must include 5 quotes from the novel (including chapter it came from)

    i dont know where to start..so as you can see i am totally lost and i really need someone's help.

    lol I'm starting to realize that there are A LOT of kids coming to this forum in need of homework help.
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  12. #27
    the beloved: Gladys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
    Good question, and you're absolutely right, Outer Party members just wouldn't know of Room 101's existence.

    The bloke was a plant from the Thought Police.
    How is the emaciated "skull-faced man" with fingers broken a plant?

    And what of, "One, a woman, was consigned to 'Room 101', and, Winston noticed, seemed to shrivel and turn a different colour when she heard the words"? Is she a plant too?

  13. #28
    Orwellian The Atheist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gladys View Post
    How is the emaciated "skull-faced man" with fingers broken a plant?
    Because he wouldn't be allowed out of Room 101 unless it suited the Thought Police to allow it to spread the fear to others.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gladys View Post
    And what of, "One, a woman, was consigned to 'Room 101', and, Winston noticed, seemed to shrivel and turn a different colour when she heard the words"? Is she a plant too?
    She'd probably been conditioned the same way.

    The giveaway is that Winston didn't know of Room 101 until he entered Miniluv, so the knowledge wasn't outside. Inside Miniluv, nobody can hear you scream...

    ...unless the Thought Police require it.
    Go to work, get married, have some kids, pay your taxes, pay your bills, watch your tv, follow fashion, act normal, obey the law and repeat after me: "I am free."

    Anon

  14. #29
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    He was teaching us that all things are possible within a mind if it is forced to confront its worst fear, that we all have those fears, and maybe, in his own way, George Orwell was trying to tell us not to let those fears overcome us - if we deal with fears, they will never grow to Room 101 proportions.
    A great foreshadow for this would be when Winston didn't think he could touch his toes, but in light of his change of lifestyle at home, he ended up being able to do it. I mean, it didn't have to be the extreme of facing one's worst fear, but many things he wouldn't expect was possible became possible when he was exposed to certain things.

  15. #30
    Tralfamadorian Big Dante's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gladys View Post
    How is the emaciated "skull-faced man" with fingers broken a plant?

    And what of, "One, a woman, was consigned to 'Room 101', and, Winston noticed, seemed to shrivel and turn a different colour when she heard the words"? Is she a plant too?
    The skull faced man may or may not be a plant. When Winston looks in the mirror during his torture he saw himself as a skull faced man and so it is possible that someone very much like himself was used as a plant during their own brainwashing.

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