I'm not a Muslim, so I don't really care. But, yes, to them you 'work' your way into Paradise. That's part of their philosophy and, to them, nature is living proof of it (the lazy die off while the strong inherit). You stand as good a chance of proving them wrong as they do disproving you.
ok, so u all made good, long points that lost me somewhere along the way, so even though this thing is 7 pages long, i'm gonna be responding to the first one and a half pages.
firstly,i really resent ppl using religious wars as a justification not to believe in the religions. PPL KILL PPL. religions are just what's blamed. most of the religions involved actually in no way condone killing others. (apart from those weird cults, which still usually suggest u kill urself, not others) i am a christian, but i hardly go to church and have not read, nor would i prolly agree with everything that the bible says. religion, with all things is something that has to be considered in context. maybe i'm just someone who's been brainwashed into believing christianity, because, indeed, how do i know it's true? but how do believe anything's true?
how can u justify ur own existance? this is a question that's been around for centuries (BEFORE THE MATRIX). desmond cartes summed it up in his terms 'i think therefore i am' ie, the mind can think and therefore we ourselves must exist. our thoughts verify our own existance. so if this is true, anything that we ourselves believe to be true is real for us ourselves. a lie, if i believe it is true, is true for me; real for me. (remember, it's not a lie if u believe it's true-george-seinfeld) regardless of whether or not it actually is. this is the paradox of life-i could be wrong, but HOW COULD YOU POSSIBLY PROVE IT? our lives are defined by our own existance, an existance we can only verify within our own minds.
i saw someone with the username 'lain'. in the anime lain, (which i didn't really like, but am introducing for intertextuality purposes) she discovers that she is not a person, but a program (sounds matrix-y, but i think the matrix ripped it off, since lain was made beforehand anyway). how do u know i'm real? u can read what i've written, but maybe i'm not a person. maybe a computer glitched and what ur reading is a side effect of some of the weird *** binary. u either believe i'm who i say i am, or believe that i'm a sixty yr old, fat, sweaty californean guy, and if u please to believe that, it's true for you.
therefore the whole world is completely arbitrary-me, u, and religion too.
i'll be posting other replies to the next five pages!
Don't part with your illusions. When they are gone you may still exist, but you have ceased to live.
(Mark Twain)
by the way, with abdo's time theory. i really like the idea, but something i'd like to ask- why did u use 1/2-1/4-1/8...? the solution to 1/2-1/4-1/8.. is zero, but since it is not a geometric progression - there can be no common ratio unless u separate it into 1/2 subtract the sum to infinity of -1/4 with the common ratio 1/2, otherwise i don't know of how u would calculate it. it results in zero, alright, but i can't see how this proves that time is made of infinate zeros, because u have to split up the two terms to calculate it in the first place. so how does that prove it? in the end, the calculation is 1/2-1/2=0. so what? (am i just dumb?)
Don't part with your illusions. When they are gone you may still exist, but you have ceased to live.
(Mark Twain)
i don't know if u've already covered this-sorry if u have- i just want to add my opinion, so here's another thing; i don't think that God is gonna condemn someone living in the african desert to eternal hell just because they'd never heard of him. i think if there is a heaven or hell, it'll be how u've lived that determines whether or not u get in. i mean, i've met a lot of ppl who r like ' i go to church everyday and everything'- they outwardly lead the really religious life, but they're really not such nice ppl. God isn't an idiot. i'm sure he'd choose the innocent person over the guilty. (yes, i'm assigning the pronoun 'he'. so shoot me. i'm only doing it out of convenienc-God is God, so in reality probably doesn't really have a sex.)
i'm really sorry i keep adding posts, but if i read the whole thing through i'll get my ideas confused (i guss i am just dum-dumb) and also forget what i had to write. i'd edit these all into one post if one of u can tell me how? ( or maybe i'll just write an essay on all this and post it up. ))
Don't part with your illusions. When they are gone you may still exist, but you have ceased to live.
(Mark Twain)
i don't know if u've already covered this-sorry if u have- i just want to add my opinion, so here's another thing; i don't think that God is gonna condemn someone living in the african desert to eternal hell just because they'd never heard of him. i think if there is a heaven or hell, it'll be how u've lived that determines whether or not u get in. i mean, i've met a lot of ppl who r like ' i go to church everyday and everything'- they outwardly lead the really religious life, but they're really not such nice ppl. God isn't an idiot. i'm sure he'd choose the innocent person over the guilty. (yes, i'm assigning the pronoun 'he'. so shoot me. i'm only doing it out of convenienc-God is God, so in reality probably doesn't really have a sex.)
i'm really sorry i keep adding posts, but if i read the whole thing through i'll get my ideas confused (i guss i am just dum-dumb) and also forget what i had to write. i'd edit these all into one post if one of u can tell me how? ( or maybe i'll just write an essay on all this and post it up. ))
Don't part with your illusions. When they are gone you may still exist, but you have ceased to live.
(Mark Twain)
about the nature-black hole thing, have u ever actually seen a black hole? been sucked into one and had ur being spagghettified (can u believe the scientific term is actually spaghettification?! )). i think the bible was supposed to be about relevent stuff to our lives, to help us live better and be a guide for us to be better ppl. some ppl take it really literal, but i think it's just a guide for our lives. why would u expect it to mention scientific phenomena? it's not like God wanted a book that explained everything about the universe on anything but a spiritual sense.
secondly, abdo, ur the second person i've come across other than me that that quotes seinfeld! ) lets fill this forum with seinfeld quotes!!! ). ohhhh yeah... (ok that was duff man, but he's funny 2 ))
Don't part with your illusions. When they are gone you may still exist, but you have ceased to live.
(Mark Twain)
i can't believe i have more crap to add. i'm so sorry if someone has to read this. i just want to share my opinion, but feel free to skip over everything i wrote. in response to the pages i've read since my last post
i don't think that the religion matters so much. it's how u live that really matters and determines the sort of person u are. ppl have used religion to justify a lot of crap that is really just their own personal wish, and i suppose that's the problem-that the bible can be so easily interpreted in so many different forms. but isn't it like that in every book u've ever read ever? besides, when is everything black and white? and if it were, wouldn't it take some of the spirituality out of religion? the meaning is simple if u don't go and convolute it. in the end, maybe u should just take the gist of it. the gist of the bible to me is that u should be a good person and try to do good things and God'll be there lookin out for u. he's always been there for me, even when i stopped being religious.
also, i'd like to say SHEA U ROCK! SERIOUSLY. and abdo, fellow seinfeld fan, i must say that i really feel like kicking ur *** for coming up with so many good arguments to undermine the bible, and even religion. let me have my ignorant faith damn u!
i think that religion stays around because PPL NEED SOMETHING TO BELIEVE IN. u can't believe that this is all there is. i just don't see how u can. u can't just think the world started with a big bang, and this is all there is. u need to believe in something else out there. some bigger purpose.
can i ask u abdo? what do u believe in? nothing?
i'd rather be an idiot who believes in something and is wrong than someone who bleakly believes in nothing and is right.
i don't know how relevant my posts have been.. but i guess the bible will always be something open to interpretation, and therefore relatively controversial given different ways of looking at it.
by the way, can we have more debate things like this? )
Don't part with your illusions. When they are gone you may still exist, but you have ceased to live.
(Mark Twain)
Fayefaye, I like to keep my beliefs to myself; easiest way in the world to avoid conflict.
AbdoRinbo
that last statement just made you sound like a hypocrite. What have you been posting for the last seven pages?
FayeFaye-
I love anime! Lain is good. Alittle axsty but good. I'm trying to follow wolfs rane right now. Anyway...TTYL!
:Chardata the Fire Mage:
Out of the darkness I come...
watch the flames engulf my body,
watch the flames consume your mind...
there is no way to break my trance...
your mind is lost in the flames...
my flames.
Oh, my beautiful flames!
My first statement made me sound like a hypocrite. Where were you?Originally Posted by Chardata
Anyway, to answer your question-----what have I been posting?-----I'll be frank.
Nothing.
chardata, I've stopped letting Abdo get to me, mostly because I realized that he reminds me a lot of my birth Dad, who can be quite humorous at times yet exaspirating, because he likes to argue a point whether or not he knows he's wrong. Lately, I've been seeing more humor (and of course good insight) in Abdo's posts even if I don't agree.
Did I read you right Abdo? I seriously meant what I said to be a compliment, so please don't take any offence.
Hwæt! We Gar-Dena in geardagum,/Þeodcuninga þrum gefrunon,/hu ða æþelingas ellen fremedon!
Oft Scyld Scefing sceaþena þreatum,/ monegum mægþum, meodosetla ofteah,/ egsode eorlas, syððan ærest wearð/ feasceaft funden; he þæs frofre gebad,/ weox under wolcnum, weorðmyndum þah,/ oðþæt him æghwylc þara ymbsittendra/ofer hronrade hyran scolde,/gomban gyldan. Þæt wæs god cyning!
nice nice...ok...i'll back down over this one. But readers beware...i don't let many ppl win. 8)
:Chardata the Fire Mage:
Out of the darkness I come...
watch the flames engulf my body,
watch the flames consume your mind...
there is no way to break my trance...
your mind is lost in the flames...
my flames.
Oh, my beautiful flames!
Flog me to death with your marching-band baton . . .
Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Matthew 7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Matthew 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Matthew 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
Matthew 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither [can] a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
Matthew 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Matthew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.Luke 13:5 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.These three quotes from the scripture deal with the inaccuracy of the first statement you made. I am only doing what 2 Timothy 4:2 says...Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Although God does not have sex. God is always refered to using masculine pronouns.2 Timothy 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
Jonus
Whatever happened to peace on earth?
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