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Thread: Politically correct liberals & born-again's in Alaska join forces to ban books

  1. #16
    Registered User newby's Avatar
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    We are heading to Orwell's dystopian world.
    Useful idiots are the worst kind of ignorance that there is, because of their arrogance they think that they are smarter than anyone else.

  2. #17
    A User, but Registered! tonywalt's Avatar
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    Banning books in Alaska? How would that be done?

  3. #18
    The Wolf of Larsen WolfLarsen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonywalt View Post
    Banning books in Alaska? How would that be done?
    I spent a lot of time in Alaska. In Alaska, there is the right combination of born-again Christians & politically correct liberals to basically ban anything obscene. These born-again Christian conservatives & politically correct liberals praise "freedom of speech", but they are hypocrites.

    But the same thing is happening pretty much in the rest of the USA now. The worlds of comedy, literature, painting, etc. are all being heavily censored by some kind of coalition of born-again Christians & politically correct liberals.

    This kind of phenomenon can be found in places like liberal Democrat-voting "Segregation City" Chicago, where racism & other forms of bigotry are considered acceptable in certain comedy venues. However, obscenity is not permitted. It depends on the comedy venue.

    And because of bans on obscenity, many Poets don't even bother going to certain poetry open mics.
    "...the ramblings of a narcissistic, self-obsessed, deranged mind."
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  4. #19
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    It's happening here in the UK as well. A University recently cut Chaucer from their reading list. Apparently, they are 'de-colonising' their curriculum (a sinister policy like that could have been invented by Stalin or Mao). So we now have the insane situation where Chaucer, the father of English literature, is no longer taught IN ENGLAND because..., well, because he's a dead white man. God knows what they'll be teaching instead. Kanye West lyrics probably. I honestly don't know where this will end. Nothing would surprise me anymore. It wouldn't surprise me if one day Rembrandt's portraits are burned because they only show white faces. To make it even more insane, I have an British-Indian friend here in the UK who loves Chaucer and is planning to do a PhD on him!!
    Last edited by WICKES; 01-25-2021 at 11:57 AM.

  5. #20
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    I do not support the idea of banning books or mediums of any form. But again freedom of expression is a double-edged sword with its own social repercussions and issues. Choosing a sect of "woke" to judge the good and bad are equally dangerous.

  6. #21
    Registered User RetsixArp's Avatar
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    When I see stuff about banning books, I think of the quote attributed to German essayist & poet Heinrich Heine; to wit: Where people are burning books, they will burn men next; or words to that effect.

    But concerning "PC liberalism" & "Christian conservatism," I view both as oxymorons. "Politically correct" has come to mean "censorship"; which sounds reactionary to me. To be a "born-again Christian conservative" means to spread the word of Christ to all; a very liberal undertaking, especially here in the US of A where you take full advantage of that very liberal First Amendment.

    "Conservative" & "liberal" have never meant anything here stateside; at least not in the sense of meaning in Great Britain & continental Europe. Late political scientist John P. Roche (b. 1923; d. 1994) wrote that those words simply have not survived transition to the States; so we're left w/ "liberal-conservative" & "moderate progressive," which serve basically to take up space in editorials & permit busybodies to establish their niche in the public discourse.

    Your are correct, tho: Artists of any ilk should be partaking in that public discourse--which, sadly, is restricted (read: censored) by major media outlets--to condemn book banning or censorship of all kinds. I still recall being so puzzled after I read "The Catcher in the Rye" in h.s., started trolling in libraries for "criticism," & read how often that book was banned; along w/ writers as diverse as Theodore Dreiser & Margaret Mitchell! Definitely a hallmark of Mencken's "booboisie!"
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  7. #22
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    Delighted to see how much antagonism towards wokeness there is here. Rare to find that in literary circles.

  8. #23
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    Glad to see Wolf still wearing his thermal shirt. What he should do is memorise a "banned" book and /or carve it on Mount Rushmore.

  9. #24
    The Wolf of Larsen WolfLarsen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ennison View Post
    Glad to see Wolf still wearing his thermal shirt. What he should do is memorise a "banned" book and /or carve it on Mount Rushmore.
    Beautiful! LOve it!
    "...the ramblings of a narcissistic, self-obsessed, deranged mind."
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  10. #25
    Dance Magic Dance OrphanPip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WICKES View Post
    It's happening here in the UK as well. A University recently cut Chaucer from their reading list. Apparently, they are 'de-colonising' their curriculum (a sinister policy like that could have been invented by Stalin or Mao). So we now have the insane situation where Chaucer, the father of English literature, is no longer taught IN ENGLAND because..., well, because he's a dead white man. God knows what they'll be teaching instead. Kanye West lyrics probably. I honestly don't know where this will end. Nothing would surprise me anymore. It wouldn't surprise me if one day Rembrandt's portraits are burned because they only show white faces. To make it even more insane, I have an British-Indian friend here in the UK who loves Chaucer and is planning to do a PhD on him!!
    I'd encourage you to actually learn what decolonizing a curriculum actually entails, it is not banning Chaucer. Further research showed the decision to remove Medieval literature was driven primarily by a lack of student interest, this was expressed alongside an interest to revitalize interest by producing a de-colonized curriculum. Decolonizing the curriculum was not why Medieval lit was removed from the University of Leicestershire's curriculum. The fact of the matter is English departments in most universities are facing rapid drops in enrollment over the past 10 years in particular. My own university has difficulty filling 2nd and 3rd year courses. Period specialists are not being replaced during hires because departments see no demand from students. I'm teaching my department's Shakespeare class this Fall despite not being a theatre specialist or an Early Modernist, I was just the next best option as a Restoration specialist. Decolonization efforts are not a serious attempt at reworking curriculums due to a PC plot, but rather are mostly a reaction to the fact that more than half of our students these days are POC and feel no connection or interest in English literature when it presents itself as an institution of white elitism.
    "If the national mental illness of the United States is megalomania, that of Canada is paranoid schizophrenia."
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  11. #26
    On the road, but not! Danik 2016's Avatar
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    Hi, Orphan,

    Wouldnt that be an opportunity to rework the curriculum? Students everywhere are losing the interest in Literature. One cant remove Ancient and Medieval Literature altogether if one wants to maintain a historical perspective. But maybe highlight Colonial and Postcolonial Literature and Diversity?
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  12. #27
    Dance Magic Dance OrphanPip's Avatar
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    I think the availability of faculty and enrollment numbers are more likely to influence what courses are offered than any ideological desire to expunge Medieval literature. Large universities with established departments might be able to dictate the curriculum to their students, but the competition for students in smaller universities simply means offering Medieval literature classes will just waste resources. There's pressure to teach courses on television and popular fiction because those courses are popular with students. I'm not sure what the solution to saving English departments is, but at their current rate I think many universities might be absorbing English faculty into service positions teaching writing courses and a few electives. It doesn't help that in Canada the university funding system is highly reliant on foreign students, who pay non-subsidized tuition rates and bring in big money for the school. The international students are generally more interested in studying STEM fields than the humanities, apart from some American students from border states. I am teaching as a sessional so my future in academia is highly uncertain.

    As far as I'm concerned when I'm designing my Shakespeare course the idea of decolonialism comes in with a focus on the continuity of interpretation, particularly in forms of theatrical adaptation that challenge the cultural values that are embedded in the text. I try to make sure the reactions and interpretations of people of colour are part of the narrative. Foregrounding the work of scholars of colour also helps to communicate to the students that Shakespeare belongs culturally to all of them and not simply to white people. There's a scholarly initiative in the US and Canada called RaceB4Race that is dedicated to coming up with solutions to teaching Medieval and Renaissance literature in ways that are cognizant of the experiences of non-white students and scholars.
    "If the national mental illness of the United States is megalomania, that of Canada is paranoid schizophrenia."
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  13. #28
    On the road, but not! Danik 2016's Avatar
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    "As far as I'm concerned when I'm designing my Shakespeare course the idea of decolonialism comes in with a focus on the continuity of interpretation, particularly in forms of theatrical adaptation that challenge the cultural values that are embedded in the text. I try to make sure the reactions and interpretations of people of colour are part of the narrative. Foregrounding the work of scholars of colour also helps to communicate to the students that Shakespeare belongs culturally to all of them and not simply to white people. There's a scholarly initiative in the US and Canada called RaceB4Race that is dedicated to coming up with solutions to teaching Medieval and Renaissance literature in ways that are cognizant of the experiences of non-white students and scholars. "

    That seems to be an interesting approach, Orphan. I think the historical approach is also helpful, because it shows what Literature and readers own to their context. For example your comment set me thinking about the race issues in Elizabethan England. At least two of the plays are the proof to my mind, that there were some: Othelo and The Merchant of Venice. And maybe it is not for nothing that both plays are set far outside England.
    #Stay home as much as you can and stay well

  14. #29
    Voice of Chaos & Anarchy
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    People have been trying to make their own opinions the only official ideas for as long as we have recored, and the effort probably started long before. I think this is another reason why I should be made Emperor. Then I will ban that kind of thinking, and everyone will have to become open-minded and allow all sorts of ideas.
    Last edited by PeterL; 07-25-2021 at 01:59 PM.

  15. #30
    The Wolf of Larsen WolfLarsen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterL View Post
    People have been trying to make their own opinions the only official ideas for as long as we have recored, and the effort probably started long before. I think this is aanother reason why I should be made Emperor. I will ban that kind of thinking, and everyone will have to become open-minded and allow all sorts of ideas.
    Beautiful!
    "...the ramblings of a narcissistic, self-obsessed, deranged mind."
    My poetry, plays, novels, & other stuff on Amazon:
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