Intelligence In The Ancient World

[starrwriter]

The other night on the History Channel I saw a fascinating program about Heron of Alexandria which showed that modern humans are no more intelligent now than some people were two millenia in the past. The major difference is technological media, not intelligence.

Born circa 75 A.D., Heron was a Greco-Roman engineer and mathematician who:

(1)Invented a steam engine 1,700 years before the Industrial Revolution. If it had been put to use, steam chariots and even railroads might have criss-crossed the Roman Empire.

(2)Developed a stage theater with audio and visual special effects. One effect was sets that automatically moved on and off stage in synch with the unfolding plot of the play. The motion was generated by using the force of gravity.

(3)Invented a mechanical program that worked like a computer software program. It used ropes wound around a spindle, pulleys, strategically placed pegs and gravity. If the media had been electricity and integrated circuits instead of gravity and natural materials, Heron would have become the Bill Gates of his era.

(4)Designed war machines that gave the Roman Legions a distinct advantage in battle. (Heron's one fault -- he was a "defense" contractor.)

The best minds of today are no sharper than the intellectual elite of the ancient world. Human intelligence has NOT evolved to a higher level. We have simply become more specialized in an increasingly complex division of labor. As Henry David Thoreau observed: "We live like ants, though the fable tells us we were changed into men long ago."

[rachel]

Stellar reporting. just imagine a railroad across the roman empire. I would have loved to have met the gentleman.
your reporting skills are still honed and a pleasure to read.
I never used to read any of the work on this forum, it made me so exhausted with all the writing i do. now I look so forward to it, not the least your contributions.
Now this is the blazing Starr that I first met. A great mind, sharp like a saber.

[RobinHood3000]

The problem with the Hellenistic cultures and the steam engines were that they were a slave-dependent society. As such, they regarded the steam engine as purely a toy--had it become employed as it was in the Industrial Revolution, those in power would have lacked a means to keep conquered peoples occupied and under control.

And I agree with you about ancient peoples. In the first millenium B.C.E., for example, had the Chinese chosen to try, they may very easily have been able to conquer the world. Gunpowder, primitive rockets, compasses, silken armor (relatively useful for preventing arrow from penetrating too deeply), seismographs, stirrups and crossbows (the former borrowed from the Mongols, I'm not sure when)...the displays of technological prowess go on.

[Charles Darnay]

Lest we forget that the Minoans on Crete had working toilets? If that isn't a sign of advanced intellegence, then what is?

But truly, intellegence has not changed from then to now, some have even gone so far as to say that we are digressing.... perhaps.

[starrwriter]

Stellar reporting. just imagine a railroad across the roman empire. I would have loved to have met the gentleman. your reporting skills are still honed and a pleasure to read. I never used to read any of the work on this forum, it made me so exhausted with all the writing i do. now I look so forward to it, not the least your contributions. Now this is the blazing Starr that I first met. A great mind, sharp like a saber.
Your words arouse me. You want to fool around?

[RobinHood3000]

Your words arouse me. You want to fool around?
Proof postive that the minds of many have yet to advance beyond Neanderthal intelligence :p.

As for the ancient world, the capacity for innovation was definitely there. It was only the resources that were lacking--people thought that the Earth was the center of the universe because they didn't know any better, in fact had no way to know better until their technology became substantially more advanced.

[rachel]

Oh Starr I give up. You have the absolutely wrong person in mind with me. :confused: I only wish that you will have a Dickenson Christmas and wake up tomorrow with a clean tongue, heart and mind which I know are all dear under that goop.(i know nobleness is humbug to -an undigested bit of beef.)
Thank you M'Lord now I know you are the leader to be under. If only the Lady Scher would give you a chance. What a mighty army we shall be.

[starrwriter]

Oh Starr I give up. You have the absolutely wrong person in mind with me. I only wish that you will have a Dickenson Christmas and wake up tomorrow with a clean tongue, heart and mind which I know are all dear under that goop.
Gotcha!

It is so easy to pull your chain, Rachel. You never know when I'm teasing you or being facetious. I couldn't resist when I read the praise you heaped on my writing. I just had to try a harmlessly crude (but funny) remark to see if you had finally managed to understand my wild sense of humor.

Your angel's wings are still safely in place. You should read "Summer and Smoke," a play by Tennessee Williams.

[starrwriter]

Proof postive that the minds of many have yet to advance beyond Neanderthal intelligence.
Og the caveman says: "Neanderthal strong. Pencil-neck geek wuss."

[RobinHood3000]

What's that? I'm sorry, I couldn't hear you over the sound of my newly-invented bombard obliterating your cave.

[starrwriter]

What's that? I'm sorry, I couldn't hear you over the sound of my newly-invented bombard obliterating your cave.
Og the caveman says: "Only wuss in tights use bombard instead of club and fists."

[RobinHood3000]

Fine, if you insist.

~smacks starr in the head, then rolls a twenty-sided die~

Whoo!! 18 damage!!

[Taliesin]

*start gibberish (gibberish, for most people, at least)*

Hey!

How do you roll damage with a 1d20 when you are just using fists?
If we remember correctly, projectile weapons using gunpowder do about 1d12 damage.
Or did you take some feat? Or are you some superhero?

Besides, you need to beat Ogs AC, which, considering his natural armor, is probably not so easy.

*end gibberish*

Sorry, it is late at night...

And, well, speaking of Neanderthal intelligence, Og, do you know Oop?

[RobinHood3000]

In response to the superhero question: See my avatar? :p

[rachel]

Starr,
let it be known to all on this forum that I hold you dear to my heart, admire you and think you are truly a person I would be proud to call friend. I just am very strong about certain things for a reason. But I would also fight to the death for you and help you at any time any place.
Just so you know.

[rachel]

oh and Starr,
the reason it is eady to pull my chain is

that it is attached to my heart.

[starrwriter]

Starr, let it be known to all on this forum that I hold you dear to my heart, admire you and think you are truly a person I would be proud to call friend. I just am very strong about certain things for a reason. But I would also fight to the death for you and help you at any time any place.
Just so you know.
Thanks. Check your PMs.

[RobinHood3000]

Hmm. No public propositioning. Excellent show of restraint, starr :p.

[Scheherazade]

Hmm. No public propositioning. Excellent show of restraint, starr :p.No wonder the thread is called 'Intelligence in the Ancient World'!

:p

[rachel]

ah Scher you are a master of words and wit and beauty.
I am signing off after today for the holidays but all of you will be in my heart and prayers and besides I have to sew my lincoln green outfit.
Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays and Happy New Year
Take care M'Lord and be blessed